Inverter seems to be stuck in Bulk Charge mode

[Ante Peros]

We have had our 2008 Beaver Patriot Thunder (Brandywine) in storage since March and decided to take her out for a bit and do some preventive maintenance and enjoy a bit of time away. We arrived and plugged into shore power and continued to set up and enjoy the day. An hour or so later we noticed a clicking noise and checked the passenger side bay with the inverter. One of the AGS lights was flashing red  and the other was green. The inverter seemed very warm. We checked the Magnum board and it was showing fault. We pushed the inverter button and the program went into Bulk charging and we thought we were back in business. Then the microwave, refrigerator, and plugs went off for a few minutes and then back on. We have tried putting the Magnum in standby charge and it then goes into bulk charge until it passes 14.1 and the power to those appliances goes off and we start over in bulk charge at 13.2 until it reaches 14.2 again and then the appliances shut off and we start again. It will not go into absorption mode. Does anyone have any ideas for us? Ante and Ginny Peros

[Eric Maclean Co-Admin]

Ante
First thing to do is a hard reset, this is done by disconnecting the shore power and the battery bank for several minutes and then repowering the system bank up.take note of your setting on the remote panel as you may have to reset them after the reset.
While your there it would be a good idea to check your batteries electrolyte levels and specific gravity in each cell looking of a bad cell                                               ( assuming they are wet cell batteries)
It's also a good time to clean all the battery terminal connections of any corrosion.
And if possible charge all the batteries and do a load test on each of the batteries individually looking for a bad or weak battery                                                           ( it's important that all the batteries be of equal size and age as the whole bank will only charge to the level of the worst battery)

Most of us like to keep our coaches plugged in when in storage in order to allow the inverter to maintain the battery bank and this is good practices but unfortunately the inverter creates a small amount of heat constantly and mice love to build their nests on top of them and of course pee in the inverter which causes issues with the electronic boards .
So check on top of the inverter for signs of a mouse nest.

Hope this helps
Eric

[Fred Brooks]

   I agree with eric! Something is causing the Inverter/Charger to mis-interpret what it is seeing. Normally if there is a bad battery or excessive resistance in the battery circuit, the charger tries to overpower it. This means the charger is working as hard as it knows how, to the point of shut down and alerting you of a problem. If it is a battery causing the issue, you may smell a rotten egg, or the battery will be hot to touch. If the terminals are corroded it will do the same thing. If you do not correct the issue, the charger will fail. Fred

[Ante Peros]

Oh my!!!! Thank you guys so much!!! Ante checked the magnum board last night at 2:30 AM and it had switched into float charge mode. So great news there but it seems to be a continual issue. We have not found a place to store our RV that has a plug in - those places were charging over 400 a month. Might be worth it in the long run. That all being said we think our initial problem has stemmed from the Battery Cut-off switch on the passenger side door panel. The light never switched on or off no matter what the position and we were confused as to when it was off or on. When we took the RV out of storage yesterday the close privacy curtain switch worked without turning anything on! So we had not put the Battery Cut Off switch in the right position. We had dutifully turned off the battery banks under the coach though. We have tried to have that switch serviced several times and all the mechanics swear it is working but still replaced it - the new switch doesn't even have a light....The last service guy said he thought the switch had been disabled so not to worry about it. But evidently, it is not disabled so it was left on when we stored it. Seems like we have been draining our batteries!!!! We are doing maintenance this week and will check each battery separately. We have yet to replace the 4 small house batteries - but we have replaced the big chassis batteries last year but were still getting low battery messages. We are getting closer to figuring this out! All the input is amazing!!!! Thank you so much!!! Ginny and Ante

[Joel Ashley]

Had issues with squirrels setting up camp on top of our warm inverter a couple of years back.  Parked for years, I'd leave the system plugged in over the winters when solar was scarce to keep the batteries up.  In summer solar alone was enough, so the inverter didn't get warm as I wasn't plugged in. 

S*** (and p***) happens, pun intended.  Cost me time and effort to get the inverter engineered out of the coach, cleaned, and then money to get it checked out, and reinstall it.  Then the critters got in again, rinse and repeat, except the empathetic repair company didn't charge the second time.  By then Magnum parts were not to be found anyway, so I lucked out that they could get it going.  Getting the thing off the bay ceiling and back, twice, was a trip for an old codger! 

The only place I could fathom the critters were getting in was a wiring loom port along the curbside rail into the adjoining waste tank and utilities bay.  I tried my best to spray anti-rodent expanding foam up in the wire port, but couldn't really get at or see it very well, and mostly made a sticky mess.  But I thought I had things licked... until this winter when I found a couple new turds in the inverter's bay, and the inverter quit again.  Welcome to RV ownership!  I've yet to summon the wherewithal to empty the storage bay and crawl in there again.  We'll see.  I've been checking and keeping the batteries up with a new nifty charger I researched and like, a Noco Genius10.  With battery Mains off, I only need to hook the charger up once every 4-6 weeks just as a check and top off (or chassis pair equalize), but while switched off the batteries stay up pretty much on their own.

As to your "Battery Cut-off" switch, aka Salesman's switch or labeled "Coach Power", it is a common trouble spot.  Experienced advisors will tell you to leave it on;  if you want to stop 12v drainage, shut off the Main switches in the battery bay instead.  Tape the entry door Salesman's switch down, cover it so grandkids can't mess with it, or jumper its connections so it can't be used on purpose or inadvertently.  Ken Carpenter, revered Beaver Coach service advisor much missed, once warned me in no uncertain terms (but with a chuckle) that if I ever shut that switch off he'd know it and come find me!  The switch, that feeds through a Ford-style solenoid on the battery/fuse bay sidewall, is apparently susceptible to wear and leaving folks without certain interior amenities.  If it wasn't the switch wearing out, it could be the solenoid, which was part of our issue at the time Ken chimed in.  Owners would be in the habit of hitting the switch when leaving the coach for dinner out or longer periods, obstensibley to save battery strength.  But in time the switch or solenoid failed to actually shut off, leaving batteries connected to interior features that slowly drained things.  I'm no expert here, but would expect to find voltage at the small + terminal of that solenoid if the entry door switch was on, so you can tell which position is which.  Others here may better advise.

Joel

[Ante Peros]

So much great stuff here!!!! We have been totally flummoxed with that silly switch. We have a solar battery charger we could use to top off the batteries while storing. I just don't want to have to keep re-setting the microwave clock while the Bulk charging process goes on and on... We've debated going to the Beaver Service Shop in Bend Oregon and have the whole thing "serviced" and maybe see if they have a class Beaver 101...We have owned our "beast" for 4 years and learn something new each time we take her out. Thanks so much!!! I hope you can get up the energy to crawl back in their!! Thanks so much!  Ante and Ginny Peros

[Joel Ashley]

Ante, plan on attending a BAC rally asap this year.  You’ll get tons of help and advice from experienced Beaver owners.  In person, hands-on help is invaluable.
😉

Joel

[Ante Peros]

I have been trying to schedule one - I have a sister in Lake Havasu, so the Quartzsite one always is on the list. I'll keep trying. I have heard they are amazing!  Ante

[Scott Shearer]

Ante,

Here are some important points regarding battery draw when storing the 2006 and newer Marquis and Patriots off-grid.

Manual battery disconnects (battery compartment):
Even when manual battery disconnect switches are set to OFF, they don’t cut off all 12-volt power. There’s still battery draw, especially on the house (domestic) batteries.

Some circuits in both the front and rear run bays remain ‘constant hot’ (always powered). This includes the CO2 detector (front run box), propane detector (front run box), Aqua Hot system (rear run box), and the inverter, which is the largest draw—all unaffected by the position of the house disconnect switch.

Solar charging is also unaffected by the battery disconnect switches.

Dash-mounted BATT CUT-OFF switch / Coach Power / Salesman Switch:
Starting in 2006, Monaco upgraded the electronic house battery disconnect system for Marquis and Patriot models. This new system is much more robust than earlier versions. The BATT CUT-OFF system is managed by the BIRD-Battery Control Center circuit board (PCB6), with two latching relays controlling power to the domestic distribution fuse box (bedroom closet) and the main domestic power supply to the front run box. The BATT CUT-OFF switch does not disconnect all house circuits. Its weakest point is the dash-mounted switch. The circuit board and relays are located in the rear run bay.

For more information, see the white paper on the BIRD-Battery Control Center system in Coach Assist under Technical > Common Problems > Support Systems > Battery Charging Systems.

Inverter/charger:
The inverter continues to operate normally regardless of whether the manual or electronic battery disconnect switches are turned off. It can invert when shore or generator power isn’t present, and it can charge when shore or generator power is connected. If the Search Watt feature is active, the inverter may begin inverting automatically, even if it has been turned off from the remote panel. Inverting draws heavily from the house battery bank.

Note that if either manual disconnect is set to OFF, the BIRD system won’t function, and only the house batteries will receive a charge.

Aqua Hot:
2005 and newer Marquis and Patriots equipped with Aqua Hot model AHE-100-04S and above, unlike the earlier versions, the wet bay heat operates as its own Aqua Hot zone, it is not piggybacked off an interior heat zone. The wet bay is controlled by an adjustable thermostat located curbside in the wet bay; it does not have an OFF setting. Whenever the wet bay temperature falls below the thermostat’s set point (typically 45 degrees), the zone activates, running the Aqua Hot circulation pump and heat exchanger fan until the thermostat is satisfied.

The problem is that the wet bay thermostat can activate the heating zone even if the Aqua Hot burner switches are turned off and regardless of whether the boiler is hot or cold. Similar to how the inverter operates, this behavior is unaffected by the position of either the manual or electronic battery disconnects. As a result, during extended periods of cold weather, the wet bay heating zone may continue running for several days.

Kongsburg CCM-equipped coaches (some 2008 and newer Marquis and Patriots):
Monaco modified the BATT CUT-OFF system and ‘constant hot’ circuits for Kongsburg CCM-equipped coaches, using just one latching relay for the domestic fuse distribution box. The CO2 and propane detector distribution circuits were moved from the front run bay to the bedroom closet fuse box.

The only way to prevent battery drain when storing your coach off-grid is to disconnect the batteries.

Since your coach is a 2008 and may have Kongsburg CCM, mentioning this in your signature could be helpful.

-Scott