No power for brake lights at coach 7 pin connector

[Richard Shrode]

A bit of a Hail Mary since we’re traveling and am hoping for an easy fix or place to start looking. Our 2007 beaver contessa doesn’t have power for toad brake lights. Both turn signals work fine but when the brakes are applied in the coach … nothing. Plugged the toad into another rig and it had turn signals and brake lights but when plugged into our coach just turn signals, no brake lights. Plugged a tester into coach and same thing, turn signals, no brake lights.
Going to see if there’s someone in town to look at it tomorrow, but in the mean time, any suggestions of things to check?
Thank you

[Fred Brooks]

    Richard,
Did your other coach have solid red taillights or did it have yellow turn signal lenses dedicated to turn signals only? If it did, then someone installed a "combiner diode 3 to 2" adaptor to combine turn signals and brake signals together. Does your "toad" have yellow turn signal lenses? Have you checked the dedicated fuse in the front run electrical compartment for brake lights? Your coach may have a "rear run electrical panel" that may have a dedicated brake light fuse in it. Please advise. Hope this helps, Fred

[Steve Huber]

Richard,
You should be able to ID the brake light wires running to the coach rear brake lights with a meter or voltage probe. From there you can follow the wire to see if it goes into the rear connector for the toad hookup. There should be a separate pin on the connector for the brake light signal going to the toad as far as I know.
Steve

[Richard Shrode]

I will do my best to answer ….

Fred:
The coach has four stacked rear lights. Top is amber/yellow colored turn signal. Middle two are red brake lights and bottom is clear back up.
Our toad is a 2025 jeep gladiator. I don’t believe it has yellow turn signals. I installed a blue ox light wiring harness that until this trip has worked fine. I have been looking for a converter or brake light fuse etc. but I’m unsure where to look or even what they would look like. I’ve Checked fuses in the front electric bay repeatedly and haven’t found a bad one yet.

Steve:
I can ID the wires running to the rear brake lights. I haven’t traced them other than looking for a fuse or converter box. For some reason I thought those wires would be separate from what was run to the 7 way connector ….. ?

Thank you

[Fred Brooks]

   Richard,
Using a test light on the motor home plug, the 3:00 o'clock pin is the right turn signal and brake light signal and the 9:00 pin is the left turn signal and brake light signal. Have someone step on the brake pedal in the coach and see if either pin light up your test light. If so, then the issue is in the male plug. If there is no light, then the issue is on the coach side. Either in the plug, no converter, no power to the plug (fuse).

[Steve Huber]

Fred, Richard,
Just to be clear, your toad brake lights worked when attached to the coach until this trip??
Steve

[Richard Shrode]

Yes, I have power at 3 o’clock and 9 o’clock when using the turn signals, but no power when stepping on the brake pedal.
Yes, the toad brake lights worked when attached to the coach up until this trip.
I’m assuming I am looking for a fuse or relay or converter or something that’s tripped/needs replaced… I just don’t seem to be smart enough to be able to find anything like that.
I went through fuses in the rear electric compartment and all were good and nothing else in there that looked anything like a converter.
Spent two hours at a truck repair shop yesterday with them going through fuses, relays etc. and all I left with was a lighter pocket book.

[Fred Brooks]

    Richard,
 I was looking at the schematics on page 178, 179, and 180 and they show a relay #K4 as part of the tow wiring. I don't know where K4 is located. It may be located in the rear run panel or the front run panel. Fred

[Steve Huber]

Fred,
What document are you looking at with those page #s?

There is a RC4 relay in the brake light circuit but it feeds all brake lights. RC4 indicates its in the rear cap, probably in the rear bay with the other fuses, relays, etc. If it failed you would not have any brake lights.
There is an "Aux Brake Controller" fuse, F10, on the front cap PC board. May pay to check it if you haven't already.

On my 07 Contessa the Brake light signal in the coach tow connector was at the 7 O'clock position as you looked at the connector. The signal came from the right brake light. You may want to trace that wire to see if it is tied into the brake light circuit, most probably to the rear brake light wiring.

If you can ID the pin in the Toad connector that feeds the toad brake lights/controller, you will know for sure which in the RV connector has the toad brake light signal.

[Fred Brooks]

    Steve,
  I was in Coach assist in electrical schematics for a 2007 patriot thunder. I searched for a relay or a 3 to 2 converter but that was all I could find. Fred

[Steve Huber]

Richard,
Did some digging into the various docs that show the brake wiring circuit. Unfortunately we don't have a specific 07 Contessa set of diagrams. However the 08 Contessa should be wired the same way. We do also have the 07 Patriot diagrams which may help but the Patriot is a more complex coach so differences exist. That said...

The 07 Contessa brake lights are in the same bulb as the turn signals but have a separate filament so if you have the turn signal on and step on the brake, the turn signal should continue flashing while the brake light illuminates. Check that your coach does this. The wire that feeds the brake lights is labeled VGC4. Hopefully you can read it on the wiring in your coach. It is pin #5 in the tail light connector that plugs into the tail light assembly.

The diagrams also show the turn/brake light signal to the  tow connector goes directly to the connector from the turn light switch with no fuses or relays in the path.

The 07 Patriot diagrams show the brake signal runs to the tow connector on a Blue wire in the 5 oclock position. Not sure if this is applicable to the Contessa.
 
I think your problem is due to a bad connection, not a fuse or relay. That said, if it were me, I would ID the pin(s) on the Toad that supply the Toad's braking system. That will then tell you what pin(s) on the coach tow connector supply the brake signal. Then trace the wire connected to that pin. It will either be broken or have a bad connection at it's junction(s) with another wire.