Xantrex Error

[Edward Buker]

Since we have owned this coach, 5 years now, we have had an error occur every few months for our Xantrx Prosine 2.5. It will go to blinking red on the remote indicator panel but never store a code. I have concluded that it is not a degrading failing component, given it always happens randomly, and has not happened more frequently as time goes on. It will not reset from the panel, so to reset it, you drop 120V at the breaker and kill the coach house battery switch for 10 seconds, turn things back on and you are back in business. It is a minor annoyance and my sense is it was some design flaw.

Interesting thing happened today, the campground worker rolled up his gas powered mower next to our battery box area and started it up. The alarm simultaneously went off. There is a lot of stray spectrum RF noise generated by ignition coils, in the old days of mostly terrestrial TV antennas you could see the ignition noise on your TV screen when a car went by. It would appear that stray RF is either traveling from the temp sensor from the battery post or the phone line from the remote panel to the main unit, or it could ba attaching itself to the AC line/ coach wiring.  At any rate, it is stray RF causing the issue and I thought I would pass this along in case anyone else gets an error from time to time and wondered why. Probably adding a torroidal coil filter on the temp sensor line and the phone line would solve this issue but it happens infrequently so I probably will not bother with that.

Later Ed

[Fred Brooks]

                Hi Ed,

            Very interesting, My coach has done the same thing twice since we purchased our Marquis last sept. All we were doing was cruising down the interstate with the inverter on to power up the Bose so we could listen to the XM radio plugged into it. I never did find any kind of issue after checking all the peripheral support systems that control the inverter operation. I did not consider any outside inductance as a cause. Let me know if your idea works.

            Regards, Fred

[David T. Richelderfer]

Do you normally turn off your inverter... anytime?

I have turned off my inverter... maybe... five times in three years.  And that was to experiment with the battery charge levels while we were away from the coach on an all-day excursions.  We were boondocking at the time and I was wondering how well the two solar panels would keep the batteries charged.

Oh yes... and I turned everything off - both main disconnects off too - when it was in storage over the first Winter without plug-in power and in a building.  At that time about every two weeks I started the generator and engine to maintain the batteries' charge levels and warm it up, respectively.

[Carol Moffett]

Hi David,
   We only turn on the inverter if we are dry camping.  The inverter is not needed when plugged into store power.  When plugged into store power we turn on the charger and set the amps to 30 or 50, whichever is appropriate.
Carol   :^3=

[Edward Buker]

We always have the charger enabled but usually turn the inverter feature on just when we need it. Like Fred, we sometimes use it for music playing while traveling. It is a small extra load on the alternator while you are traveling unless you forget and leave something with a more significant load on. One amp at 120V on the inverter becomes more then 10 amps at 13V for the alternator to add to its normal load. Like always these things need to be managed.

Fred, I will probably never work on that Inverter RF noise error, they are like chasing witches... Good RF isolation practices would have had those toroids already built into the battery sensor, AC line, and control panel leads but Xantrex did not put them in the design and it is a bit of a pain to do it now. This issue happens infrequently enough and is corrected in less than a minute so toroids are probably more trouble then it is worth to me....however I do remember it happening in VT in the middle of a rainy night once :-)

Later Ed

[Fred Brooks]

           Hey Ed,

     Thanks for the advice, I will stay away from Vermont on a rainy day! You are one of the few fellows that have a real good handle on the inefficiency of inverters and know when it's a free ride. I thought you were on to something with this inductive inigma that causes ground loops and all sorts of wierd stuff that makes you scratch your head. I think we will leave these toroids for the next generation to prove their brilliance.

                 Regards, Fred

[Edward Buker]

Fred,

It is a wonder with all the RF around nowadays that the electronics we have are as trouble free as they are. In the analog days any RF induced noise was usually just car ignition RF induced or the old RF generated 60 cycle hum we got from power lines that got into our audio systems. Usually getting a good ground or unplugging a cable and putting it back in to clean oxidation off the ground shield contacts fixed things. Today it is more complicated.

This problem that we have isn't really a ground loops issue, it is just an RF transmitter/RF noise source in proximity of some kind of nearby wiring that acts as an antenna. If you ever want to "play" with this issue there are some inexpensive Ferrite units that absorb broad spectrums of RF and this source would be a good choice. As the RF comes down the wiring and passes through the ferrite it gets absorbed inductively like with a transformer core passing current from one winding to another to step up or step down AC voltage. These ferrites are tailored for general RF issues in the 5 to 1000Mhz range. You will recognize some of these physical shapes and units that are common in computer and monitor power cord applications.

http://www.solar-electric.com/installation-parts-and-equipment/electrical-devices-transfer-switches-noise-filters/nosufefi.html

BTW we know John and Jean Fearnow, they are in the same Bothell WA campground we are in now. I saw their cabinet and front TV install that you did and it was a beautiful piece of workmanship. I know these things are not easy having done one myself to put in a 32 inch LCD unit in an 89 Contessa. Great work Fred.

Later Ed

[Fred Brooks]

                    Ed,
 
       Thanks for the complement, As you know, John is 6" 4 or taller and the issue was getting the TV out of the entry step well as you ascend up into the coach. It took several mock ups with John to get the final location and intergrade the tv and cabinet with the existing overhead cabinets on either side.
                             Regards, Fred