Author Topic: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve  (Read 1582 times)

David T. Richelderfer

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Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« on: January 02, 2024, 10:03:38 PM »
Simply put, I am not finding the "correct" Red Hat valve replacement.  I have checked here in Yuma at Western Construction and they do not carry it.  Also, NW RV Supply in Oregon cannot get it.  Reviews seem to indicate the US Solid solenoid ball valves are very reliable.  I have asked US Solid for a look-alike replacement for the Red Hat Valve, plus the US Solid valves are 1/2 or less the price of the Red Hat valves.  For the US Solid ball valve, pressure seems to not be an issue.

Comments, suggestions, and/or experiences....
2004 Beaver Marquis Sapphire

I had a dream... then I lived it!

Bill Lampkin

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2024, 10:10:11 PM »
Look it up at Grainger's com
2005 Patriot Thunder Lexington, 3 slides
40' tag axle (short wheelbase)
525 hp C13

"Goin where the weather suits my clothes..."
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Michael DeFalco

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2024, 10:55:48 PM »
Hello David, i am not at all familiar with what the specs are for your solenoid valve . (pipe size, male or female thread etc.) but if you could cross that valve to a SPORLAN valve you would get a very solid and reliable valve.      mike   
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Gene Obie

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2005 Beaver Marquis, Ruby 40, C-13 Cat 525HP, Allison 4k
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Bill Lampkin

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2024, 09:01:45 PM »
What's the issue with your fresh water fill valve? You can buy a replacement coil, or a valve rebuild kit. Have you tried applying 12vdc to the coil?  The Aladdin tank level card can be jumpered to actuate the valve (jumper the pigtail to the red hat will give you 12vdc to the red hat.)





 
2005 Patriot Thunder Lexington, 3 slides
40' tag axle (short wheelbase)
525 hp C13

"Goin where the weather suits my clothes..."

David T. Richelderfer

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2024, 10:52:36 PM »
1. With the Red Hat closed, the water pump should pressurize the system to the pump's shut-off pressure and the pump should quit pumping.  Agree?
2. With the Red Hat open, the water pump cannot pressurize the system to its shutoff point because the open Red Hat allows water to return to the water tank.  Agree?
 
The water pump does not shutoff with the Red Hat open or closed but when I flip the toggle to alternately open and close the Red Hat, the water pump's cycle speed and pitch change.  In my opinion, this is telling me the Red Hat is not properly closing and, thus, allowing water to leak by to return to the freshwater tank.

Yes, it could be a stuck open anti-backflow valve in the water pump but I doubt the pump's cycle speed and pitch would be much affected by opening and closing the Red Hat.

The water pump is only several years old and has not been used that much.  The Red Hat is original to the manufacture date of the coach (to my knowledge) and that is over 20 years ago.  It's a 2004 Marquis manufactured in mid to late 2003.
2004 Beaver Marquis Sapphire

I had a dream... then I lived it!

Bill Lampkin

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2024, 11:34:02 PM »
On our coach, I can see the water level in the fresh water tank, and can hear the water entering the tank when filling. Maybe you could check to see if you can see/hear water flowing into the tank. Sounds like the red hat may need a new diaphragm (rebuild kit).  You could also bypass the red hat valve using a temp pipe set up to see if that fixes the problem.
2005 Patriot Thunder Lexington, 3 slides
40' tag axle (short wheelbase)
525 hp C13

"Goin where the weather suits my clothes..."

Fred Brooks

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2024, 11:36:33 PM »
    David,
Another way to isolate the issue is to remove the output fitting from the water pump and block the output off with a cap or your finger and see if the internal pressure switch shuts off the pump. If it does, then the issue is the red had valve. Fred
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David T. Richelderfer

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Re: Red Hat solenoid valve versus US Solid solenoid ball valve
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2024, 12:57:48 AM »
Well, it seems to be fixed... for now, I suppose.

Recall, with all the faucets, etc., turned OFF, the water pump would continue to cycle.  Certainly, its cycle speed was much slower than if a faucet was ON but the pump just would not shut off without flipping the pump switch to its OFF position.

First, I figured the Red Hat valve had worn out.  Reading the Forum here I saw where Red Hat valves get old/weak and don't stop the water flow when in their OFF position.  So, after nearly 20 years I simply decided to swap it out.  The change was pretty straightforward with no changes required for the Pex plumbing.  The difference is I replaced it with a "US Solid" ball valve at $50 from Amazon instead of a Red Hat solenoid "plunger" valve at near $150.  The US Solid ball valve simply rotates 1/4 turn internally to shut OFF and ON the water flow, whereas the Red Hat valve has to use power continuously to hold the plunger to turn OFF the water flow.  The ball valve uses only enough power to know it should stay OPEN and will not overheat due to its very low power usage.  The Red Hat valve uses substantial power to hold the valve open.  Red Hat states to not leave its valve OPEN under power for long periods because it will overheat.  The US Solid valve has a little window with a red line that rotates with the internal ball valve so you can see at what position the ball valve is as it moves.  And the US Solid ball valve only needs power to OPEN and stay OPEN.  When the tank fill switch is OFF, the ball valve automatically closes.  In fact, if the ball valve loses power for any reason, then it closes and stays closed until power resumes.  Its default position is CLOSED.

But, alas, the pump still ran after changing the Red Hat out to the US Solid ball valve.  Now what?  I removed the pump and took it apart.  There was a little dirt inside it but no particles of anything that would hold a seal open.  As recommended, I tried holding back the water flow out of the pump with my fingers but couldn't stop it - too much pressure!  I put my handy-dandy winterization hose on the OUTPUT side of the pump (rather than on the INPUT side when pumping in antifreeze), then kinked the hose to shut OFF the water flow.  With the water flow completely stopped from coming out of the pump, the pump continued to run!  Now what?

When I watched a video showing how to check out and repair my Shurflo water pump, it had a few words talking about adjusting the pressure switch using an Allen wrench on a screw at the top of the pump.  I screwed it down a couple of turns and now the pump turns OFF when it gets up to its "shut-off pressure."  Perhaps a temporary fix?

70F here today, no clouds, no wind, all doors on the house open, ceiling fan going to keep air moving.  I love Yuma!!!

« Last Edit: January 15, 2024, 05:36:07 PM by David T. Richelderfer »
2004 Beaver Marquis Sapphire

I had a dream... then I lived it!