GCFI question

[Dale Walker]

Sorry guys, but I found out day before yesterday, there is no 110 in the basement. I have researched it on another website, but no real definitive location. I have the schematics but all it shows is that they go to the #5 breaker. So, the question, is there a master? What have I missed??

Thanks.

[David T. Richelderfer]

Our coach has several 110v circuits each with several receptacles in both the living area and basement.  There is one receptacle on each circuit that has a white paper stuck on its face that indicates that particular receptacle is also the GFI (ground fault interrupt) on that particular 110v circuit.  In the bedroom there are two upper cabinet doors, one with the main 110v breaker panel, and the other with the main 12v breaker panel and a small 110v breaker sub-panel.  The 110v breaker sub-panel is there for the powered awnings, etc.  Occasionally we have to reset a GFI; rarely do we have to reset a breaker.

[Dale Walker]

Thanks David, I will check it out in the morning, thanks for the quick reply!

[Joel Ashley]

Ours is a year newer, so I'm not certain if the same technology went into yours.  But the circuits in our second breaker box (30 amp Main via the inverter and just to the right of the 50 amp Main box in the bathroom) are all GFCI protected because the breakers themselves have GFCI (Ground Fault Circuit Interupter) built in to them, thus doing away with the old and common outlets with little test buttons on them.  You can tell if the breakers are GFCI by the yellow reset button on their face below the switch.

And yes, the #5 breaker in the 30 amp Main box is for the circuit with the bay and dash outlets.

That said, we do have an outlet (with no buttons), a coax plate, and I think a telco plate along the upper left wall of the main curbside bay.  I'm not sure why you wouldn't have them in a similar location;  most coaches I've seen do, and likely as a standard factory feature, not as an option, for patio TV and audio use, etc.

-Joel

[Dale Walker]

Thanks, Joel, the picture you post, looks like the one I have in the bathroom. Every receptacle in the bay, and bathroom have a sticker that indentify's them as GCFI. Tomorrow, I will check out all my new found knowledge. LOL!! Thank you very much!

[Dale Walker]

Well, sorry, I didn't get back about my problem until today. I decided the first thing I should do is buy one of the cheap testers that plug into the receptacle. It has a button to test the GFI. So today I checked the receptacles in the Bay, nothin', checked the one up by the driver, nothin'. so I went back and pulled the cover on the panel, checked all the receptacles with my checker, #5 did nothin'. So decided it was time to get serious, #'s 4, 3, 2, were all 20 amp. so I thought I'd just switch one that I knew worked so pulled out #5 and discovered, two wires, a black one and a white one, both were taped. So I thought what the hell, I hooked them back on the breaker, and walla! The Bay and the driver receptacle both work! I tried my checker, and they all work? Now, I'm stumped, can anyone think of a reason to pull the wires from that breaker? There are 2 receptacles in the Bay, one had a cord plugged in that was marked, heat tape. Now if they were having problems with that breaker, why wouldn't they unplug the heat tape? At least to check that it was the reason the breaker kept tripping. So, I left the tape unplugged, will see if there is still a problem with the circuit. Thanks for all your help.

[Edward Buker]

Dale,

This is speculation....the reason to pull power wires at a breaker and tape them off is you have a short circuit that you cannot find the source of and you decide to make it home and then intend to repair it. Maybe traded the coach in with the problem.

There are times where in motorhome AC wiring systems that you get a GFCI outlet that continually trips and at times you just cannot find the source of the stray current which can be an oxidized contactor within the GFCI itself. I had a bay GFCI that would trip a lot and overcame that issue with a GFCI made for an outdoor environment.You may come across the issue in time that caused the original taping off of that circuit.

Last possibility is you had a bad breaker that tripped prematurely and gave the impression that there was a short problem and you disconnected it out of respect for the consequences and never trouble shot the issue.

Later Ed

[Joel Ashley]

Good ideas, Ed.  I know you've covered the low quality GFCI issue before, and it's a good possible explanation in Dale's case. 

But I don't know that he ever supplied whether the breakers in his '05 Monterey were the GFCI type (with the yellow reset buttons on them) like in my '06 Monty.  I've not heard that that type had quality issues like the older outlet-mounted ones you've dealt with, and that were in our '84 Pace Arrow.  I had one like that at my garage workbench... a new better quality one from Lowe's resolved the issue. 

If Dale does not have GFCI breakers, than indeed a bad GFCI outlet in his bay would be my first guess.  As you've related many times, much to our appreciation, the outlet may be okay but it's GFCI is too sensitive. As I recall, the GFCI is in the first outlet in any circuit, which should be Dale's curbside main bay, then the outlet in the center dash console by the drivers feet would be next in that circuit and sans a GFCI.  Slight pulse variations, not short circuits, may have provided a previous owner with an incessantly tripping outlet, so he pulled the breaker wires.  Don't know why he wouldn't just flip off the breaker.  If Dale has the GFCI integral outlet, then replacing it with a high quality outdoor one would be a likely fix to any issues there he yet finds.

Joel

[Dale Walker]

Thank you Ed and Joel, your combined knowledge is what make this forum, top notch!

Ok, I must apologize for not giving you guys enough information, but at the time, I was not aware that my coach was equipped with all GFCI, breakers. My '99 Discovery had the receptacles with the GFCI's integrated in them.

Today, I went back over, (it's in storage), and determined that #5 is indeed the right breaker, and it seems to work alright. I put my checker in the bay, turned on the breaker, and it stayed on until I pushed the button. So I reset the breaker, plugged in the heat tape and walla, the breaker tripped. So with that, I have decided the heat tape is faulty. What I don't understand is if that tape is the problem, why disable the breaker?? The things some people do, really astounds me! That breaker only has 3 receptacles.

[Edward Buker]

Dale,

Nice when it is an easy fix. Perhaps the prior owner did not know the heat tape was on that circuit or just decided enough in the coach worked with that circuit disabled. At any rate glad you have this sorted out.

Later Ed

[George Harwell]

Dale, I have a vornado fan in my living room that will trip the basement gfci when it gets too much dust buildup on the motor. I use an air hose to blow away the dust and reset the gfci to clear the problem. Sounds too easy doesn't it. GFCI circuits can drive you to drinking if you can't figure them out. Thanks to Ed Buker for his insight on electrics.

[Dale Walker]

Yes they can, George! I had receptacles in my Discovery, and remembering which one controlled the other ones was interesting. The Beaver with the GFRCI on breakers in a panel is a ray of sunshine! When I read your post about GFCI's driving you to drinking, a song came to me, "if you don't stop drivin' that hot rod Lincoln!! Ha Ha!! Life is a treat when things go your way, RIGHT??