Author Topic: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....  (Read 3564 times)

Jeff Ramey

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2000 Patriot Thunder, with CAT C-12.

Okay, pretty sure I've got a single bad part causing all these failures. Anyone got a good idea what, or where, it might be?

A few months ago, we were driving along and the engine "shut off" leaving us on the side of the road. I fired up the laptop and hit the forum. Within an hour or so of research and troubleshooting, I decided it was the solenoid and jumped it with a piece of wire which enabled us to drive to a parts store to purchase a replacement. While I was at it, I replaced the ignition switch also, as it was old and worn. You could pull the key out with the engine running, and had to wobble the key to get it to start. That all worked well and the coach starts and stays running as it should...almost.

If I turn on the dash AC blower (not even the compressor, just the fan set to ANY position.), the toggle for the driving lights, the overhead fan switch, or the headlights (except the parking lights only setting seems to work fine, maybe an indication the problem is load/current related?), OR IF I PUT THE COACH IN REVERSE, it will cause an electrical failure and shut off the engine within a few seconds. The back up camera and the Silverleaf display blinks and a second later the engine dies.

Thought maybe it was the diode on the solenoid that I replaced, but removing it completely made no difference.

I'm thinking it might be a bad relay, but which one would have all these systems in common? I've attached a picture of the left side of my dash, with the only exception being the close out toggle and the parking light setting of the headlight switch, any switch operated causes an electrical "glitch" followed by the engine shutting off.

Additionally, it takes a few seconds after it shuts down before you can start the coach back up.

 


Guy Pryor

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2018, 12:22:39 AM »
I am not an electrician and I don't play one on TV in fact I hate to work on electrical problems. But I am thinking that all the problems you are having that they are all connected to the ignition switch That you just replaced.

Steve Huber Co-Admin

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2018, 12:25:33 AM »
Jeff,
Looks like your ignition solenoid may be failing. All the circuits you mentioned (including Reverse)  are fed by the key side of the solenoid. Check out the front electrical bay print to see what I'm talking about. Since the headlights work the input side of the solenoid is staying hot. Also, could be a bad connection going to/from the solenoid. The other possibility is that the key signal to the solenoid is dropping out. Next time it happens, check for 12v on the band side of the diode. If it's there, the solenoid is bad.
Steve
Steve
2015-          07 Contessa Bayshore C9,  400 hp
2013-2015: 00 Marquis Tourmaline, C12, 425 hp
2005-2013: 01 Contessa Naples, 3126B, 330 hp

Joel Ashley

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2018, 07:47:04 AM »
Just backing up what Steve said.  So many times these or similar symptoms arrive on the Forum, and it usually turns out to be the solenoid in the front electrical bay.  Did you put the diode across the posts in the right direction?  And these solenoids come in different qualities, so even a relatively new one may be at fault.  I’d check it out before anything else.  It also sounds like a breaker or breakers overheating and needing to cool before service restores, but perhaps poor solenoids can behave that way?

Joel
« Last Edit: May 22, 2018, 08:01:41 AM by Joel Ashley »
Joel and Lee Rae Ashley
Clackamas, Oregon
36.9 ft. 2006 Monterey Ventura IV, aka"Monty Rae"
C9 400HP Cat

Jeff Ramey

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2018, 04:28:39 PM »
I'll check that, thanks. Your thoughts on the solenoid are confirming what I was suspecting. I may have received a bad/poor quality part when I purchased that solenoid. I'm going to replace it again and see if that makes a difference. I will check the diode on my meter before I reinstall it to see if it's shorted, etc. The band side goes to the front of the coach, right? I knew I should have taken a picture when I took it off  :-\ . I'll post back here with my results (I hate to leave, or read, unresolved troubleshooting posts.)

Steve Huber Co-Admin

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2018, 09:04:06 PM »
Band goes to front of coach (battery 12v supply side).
Steve
Steve
2015-          07 Contessa Bayshore C9,  400 hp
2013-2015: 00 Marquis Tourmaline, C12, 425 hp
2005-2013: 01 Contessa Naples, 3126B, 330 hp

Tic Wilson

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2018, 02:59:10 PM »
FWIW, I had a very similar problem.  When I went to purchase the replacement solenoid, the parts store tried to sell me a starter solenoid.  That would be a 35 amp, intermittent solenoid.  The coach calls for an 85 amp continuous duty solenoid on my monterey.. 

Jeff Ramey

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2018, 03:23:01 PM »
DING DING DING, WINNER WINNER, CHICKEN DINNER!
For all those that suggested I look at the less than 6 month old replacement solenoid, your instincts are right on the money. I remember thinking at the time that there was no way this cheap feeling black plastic and sheet metal solenoid could be of the same quality as the very solid feeling and heavy one I was replacing. I was right. For those interested, I installed a Cole Hersee, part # 24213, 200 amp, continuous duty solenoid I purchased at a local O'Reilly's for the respectable price of $67 and some change. Works like a champ. Thanks to all for the outstanding troubleshooting assistance, a hallmark of this forum and its members.
The following users thanked this post: Joel Ashley

Joel Ashley

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2018, 09:35:00 PM »
Glad we kept you focused on the real culprit... (you 😁 LOL) -the solenoid.

For new owners not versed in previous threads re. this often troublesome device, there is a more reliable option, a solid state electronic solenoid.  Rather than front its expense, however, many just carry a spare Cole Hersee standard one.  But at least you do have the choice.

http://www.partdeal.com/wiring-electrical/solenoids/cole-hersee-electronic-solenoid-9v-31v-48785.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&adpos=1o1&scid=scplp77148963&sc_intid=77148963&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg5zJ1d2h2wIVCarsCh1IYwMEEAQYASABEgKB-PD_BwE

Joel

« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 09:48:30 PM by Joel Ashley »
Joel and Lee Rae Ashley
Clackamas, Oregon
36.9 ft. 2006 Monterey Ventura IV, aka"Monty Rae"
C9 400HP Cat

Frank Bergamo

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« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 11:49:44 PM by Frank Bergamo »
Frank & Paulette Bergamo
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Grand Junction, CO.

Joel Ashley

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Re: Electrical gremlins? Dash AC, Driving light switch, Fan, etc....
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2018, 11:27:30 PM »
Some here opt for this coated one:
https://www.amazon.com/Cole-Hersee-24117-Continuous-Solenoid/dp/B001FQL444/ref=sr_1_5?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1492621710&sr=1-5&refinements=p_4%3ACole+Hersee

It’s less subject to accidental shorting by a tool, but may also allow 0 chance of moisture intrusion and internal corrosive breakdown.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2018, 07:47:44 AM by Joel Ashley »
Joel and Lee Rae Ashley
Clackamas, Oregon
36.9 ft. 2006 Monterey Ventura IV, aka"Monty Rae"
C9 400HP Cat