BAC Forum
General Boards => General Discussion => Topic started by: Roy Lewis on March 22, 2017, 09:06:09 AM
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Hi folks, we are fulltimers in a 02 Marquis Tourmaline 40 non tag. We recently received our insurance renewal notice through National Interstate and were greeted with quite a substantial increase. This is somewhat of a suprise because we have no tickets and no accidents in over 30 yrs. I am posing this question. Is this a national rate increase for fulltimers or is a good shopping trip in order. Many thanks in advance for your replies.
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Roy,
I have Nationwide through Overland Insurance (one of our sponsors). I have a similar excellent driving record. I just renewed my insurance this last week and there was also a significant increase. I was somewhat prepared for a large increase based on the article Ron Jarvi wrote for the recent Beaver Tales. Based on Ron's article, I guess I am fortunate to be "Grandfathered in" with Nationwide. If you haven't read the article, read it and it may give you an understanding on what is going on in the insurance industry. Ron does a good job of checking for rates. Unfortunately, the combination of high end coaches and being full time presents a problem for some Beaver owners.
The value you give for your coach has a significant impact on what your rate will be. Reevaluate your coaches value each policy period and you may be able to lower your renewal rate. I was guilty of not paying attention to this and my policy kept going up as the real value of my coach went down.
If you give Ron or Travis (Overland Insurance) a call, they are very helpful.
Bill
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Roy,
This issue has been discussed on the forum many times and sadly there is no consensus about where to go for insurance.The BAC has had an arrangement for many years with Overland Insurance whereby good advice was given and I understand favorable rates were obtained and the BAC was also able to benefit.
There are many factors to consider in purchasing motorhome insurance and there are many pitfalls also.The underwriting criteria from the insurance carriers is designed naturally to select the most desirable risk for THEM. They do not want to assume too much risk and they do not want to pay any claims.It is unfortunate that individuals are not underwritten on their own merits and risks but they are grouped together in a sort of "class" and underwritten as a group.This form of "class underwriting" does not favor us.
You may see vastly different rates based on your age,financial score,driving record,state or county residence, or other factors.I have heard many stories of people obtaining wildly differing quotes on the same age and type of motorhome. I do understand that many times these rates may be based on how you answer certain questions asked of you like where you reside and how you use your motorhome and how much is it worth and how do you want it to be reimbursed if you should suffer a loss.
It would be wonderful if all these factors could be discussed and coverage arranged based on each individuals risk and usage but that will never happen,
You must be careful how you answer all the questions as you shop and compare rates from different companies. Yes, I would encourage you to shop around and compare.
All companies and all insurance agents are not going to offer insurance on a motorhome.They are too expensive to repair and there is an inherent risk that is adverse to the company seeking to make a profit on the sale.The insurance company is all about making a profit not really being your friend.Chances are very good if you have loss you may be cancelled or your rates increased.
Since all motorhomes are kind of grouped together into a "class" if the group suffers from bad experience then the entire Class or group will see rate increases. This may not seem fair but it is the way the world of insurance works.
There is no easy answer to your question but I would surely seek as many quotes as I have the patience to obtain and compare "apples to apples" as I shop. Always tell the truth on any application you may sign but don't "volunteer" too much information that is not specifically asked for on an insurance application.
It is the actual policy that will determine coverage in the event of a loss not what any agent says or promises so read your policy and be aware of all exclusions and limitations.
I believe the marketplace to be very tough right now and I would encourage all to make sure your limits of liability are adequate and use high deductibles and be realistic in the valuation of your motorhome.On my own policy there is no exclusion if I don't own a house and there is no mention of if I "full-time" or not.There is no mileage mentioned or days on the road discussed. I insured a motorhome at an agreed value that was reasonable and I used a high deductible.
Every situation will be different and we all live in various places but what I am trying to say is be careful as you shop and make yourself as desirable as a risk as you can be. Offer the agent or company as much of your insurance business as you can. Be willing to change your auto or your home even if it costs a little more.Use a relatives or a good friends address if possible.
Don't get caught up in the physical damage part of the equation and make sure your personal liability is adequately covered.Many times a "stand alone" personal liability policy can be arranged that may cover you for that exposure while you are traveling and you only need to cover the "auto liability" on the motorhome.This may be of interest to some shoppers.
I have rambled here and I apologize.I hope some of the rambling may be helpful.
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Thanks everyone for reply! I have quotes coming from Overland today. I appreciate all the insight!
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Roy, I have National Interstate through Overland, or did until recently. Ron had called me prior to mine renewing and told me that National Interstate wont be writing policies on RV's in a year so I changed to Safeco Insurance on his recommendation. But I am not full time yet!
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Thanks to everyone on the replies, I have some background to proceed!
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I have been considering Insurance options for my 2005 Monterey. USAA linked me to Progressive which appears to be a reasonable company, but expensive. Studying market options is confusing and scary. All the companies gladly take your money, but when it comes to claims, not so much. I have seen some bone chilling testimonials and reviews regarding how companies have shafted their customers. I offer this comment because our forum tends to focus on insurance costs as opposed to acceptable claims recovery. Any thoughts or insight will be much appreciated. Note, my current costs are running at $1800 per year and Progressive is using market replacement for RV valuation. Considering adding glass coverage which will add another $200. If we go full time that will add $300, but with some additional benefits.
I look forward to any and all comments.
Thanks,
Dale
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We recently purchased a 2017 Entegra Cornerstone. In talks with Ron Jarvie we learned a lot about what was going on with LLC's and so forth. It boiled down to this for us based on the following that Ron presented and our Michigan agent checked and verified.
1. If you have an LLC you had better have insurance thru that state OR you actually do not have insurance you think you have.
2. If you carry an umbrella for liability you had better have that umbrella from the same carrier in the same state as your coach is insured in, or you do not have an umbrella in effect you think you have.
3. If you are in LLC but insure in state that requires ins agency to submit twice yearly vehicle information that they insure to sec of state and they find no licensing data you are going to get a not so friendly letter. In most cases they go for treble the sales tax you did not pay and then there are the license fees.
We were not so fond of Rons information but as we checked he was found to be very correct.
We did settle the dust with leaving the LLC and licensing in Michigan where we live and are insured thereby keeping all our insurance in tact.
For full timers which we are not you may want to council with Ron so what you actually have is actually enforce.
SAFECO is what Ron quoted us and when we referred this to our Michigan agent they also carried SAFECO. Rate was same from both agency's at just less than $1600.00 annually.
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Doug
Kudos to you for doing this research. This was one reason we chose not to pursue the LLC route when we purchased our Beaver. Im happy you got some straight answers from each of these insurance agents.
Have found Safeco to be a very fine insurance company.I represented them for many years and I believe they are now owned by Liberty Mutual Ins.
We have insurance on all our vehicles through Auto-Owners Insurance Group which is a Michigan domiciled company and we have been very happy with the premiums and the claims service for over 25 years.
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Dan, We also have all Auto Owners in Michigan and our agent was an Auto Owners employee prior to buying an Agency in Traverse City from agents that retired. Ron gave us a lot of bumps in our usual road but in the long run I believe we educated a few including ourselves and got it right this time.
From what I am hearing the states are doing a lot more investigative work and with the insurers having to provide data to the state they find the no match with plates versus insurance and that triggers some action - especially with the value on a coach purchase.
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Doug,
Thanks for the information. Timing was perfect as we are in the process of reviewing our RV insurance.
BTW: Was you quote for "Occupied less than 150 days or 250 days a year?
Currently with Good Sam's, but Ron quoted us a Michigan Safeco policy which seems competitive.
Never fun, but a necessity!
Regards,
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Doug, well said and traveling the country full time has opened the Atherton's mind
starting last November with medical issues with Wife and 1200 miles from Primary
medical Doctor. Second approved Camp Grounds stay, reguardless what kind of hook
up and electrical connections boon docking is the freedom of many RV people like ourselves,
Doug bringing up private membership for emergency services and insurance providers to
cover this service is something that never crossed our minds. A person does not understand
everything that has to be covered with insurance in today's world. Great piece of information
and thank you Doug. Dave And Pat Atherton
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I just renewed my insurance with Hartford/AARP. The rate from last year is quoted at $361 cheaper for this coming year... last year was $2,110, this coming year is $1,749. Our insurance covers three vehicles - our 2004 Marquis, my 2002 Avalanche which we tow, and Leslie's 2013 Ford Edge. I need to look into bundling the auto, house, and rental duplex coverages to see how much can be saved.
I would like to hear your opinions on getting an umbrella policy and what one would cost. I think a $1 million umbrella policy would cost another $200 to $300 - might be a good idea.
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David,
We've got an umbrella policy with The Hartford. I would not be without one. Cost wise, your estimates are low but that may depend on number of vehicles, etc.
Allstate had cheaper Umbrella rates but their auto rates were higher so we came out better overall with Hartford. RV is covered via Overland.
Steve
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David
The name "umbrella policy" kind says it all. You don't want to get caught out in a legal rainstorm without your Umbrella Policy. There are ,however, some things to consider before purchasing an umbrella.
First of all----how much insurance do I need to protect my assists??
Can I buy underlying auto and home policies with sufficient limits of liability to protect my assists without needing an umbrella?? For instance-- If you buy or own an Auto policy with a $1 million dollar limit----do you need another million on top of that amount??
Also---in every umbrella policy there is a section or clause that defines "underlying limits of liability" what they means is an Umbrella policy will not even respond to a claim until the underlying limit has been reached----so----you must make sure your underlying auto or RV policy has these sufficient limits first before you even consider an umbrella.If not then you will "been the hook" for the difference between what you should have vs what is required before the umbrella kicks in. Many times this will increase you cost because many people do not carry sufficient limits in the first place that will satisfy the requirement.
The loss ratio for umbrella policies is very low and the claims made against umbrellas are few.But, if you are a person with large assists to protect then you are certainly a candidate for an umbrella insurance policy.
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Re: Umbrella Policy. From Hartford I found out both my Residential and Rental (duplex) Policies must have a minimum of $300,000 Comprehensive Personal Liability and $300,000 of Personal Injury Liability. If those two liability limits are not met at a minimum on both policies, then Hartford will not sell an Umbrella Policy to attach to my Auto Policy (three vehicles). My Auto Policy has limits sufficient to qualify for the Hartford Umbrella Policies. Once I have verified those two liability minimums are satisfied, then Hartford will sell an Umbrella Policy for the following coverages and costs:
1. $1 million at $240 per year, or
2. $2 million at $420 per year, or
* 3. $5 million at $540 per year.
*Hartford also noted that not more than one insurance claim within five years is allowed to qualify for their $5 million Umbrella Policy.
I am waiting to hear back from my Residential and Rental Policies' agent. Plus I have invited the agent to give a cost for an Umbrella Policy. Being the July 4th weekend, I expect to get a reply from the agent next week.
Thank you for the information and opinions.
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I added the Hartford Umbrella Policy yesterday. Its effective dates coincide with our Hartford Auto Policy and its cost was $209 for one year.
The Summer is passing fast. Next week we have a four day meet-up with our Yuma Couples Golf Group at the Wildhorse RV Park near Pendleton, OR. Ten or so couples are coming, most are staying in their RVs, from California, Washington, Idaho and Oregon. It should be a fun week - 18 holes at the Wildhorse Golf Course, the Milton-Freewater (OR) Golf Course, and the Buffalo Peak Golf Course at Union, OR, plus barbecuing, sipping flavorful drinks, catching up, etc. We have a 50 amp spot for two of those days and a 30 amp spot for the last two days. I hope someone cancels on their 50 amp reservation so we don't have to move spots. With the heat we want to be able to run all three air conditioners!
I found out last week my high school graduation class is having a 50-year reunion on September 30 in The Dalles, OR. It's a good thing the organizers didn't schedule it much later. We are planning to head South by mid-October. We have our RV spot reserved for five months and are looking forward to a great Winter in the Fortuna Foothills.
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David
Sounds like a great week of golf.I wish we could join you!
Have fun and I hope you never have the chance to unfurl that umbrella!!