Magnum Intellidrive. Engine Shutdown: On

[Fred Brooks]

   Mark,
Check the ignition solenoid in the front run compartment Driver side front. Should be powered on with the key "on". Also I think the starter solenoid is activated by a "trigger solenoid" mounted not too far from the starter. (looks like a standard Ford starter solenoid). Good Luck! Fred

[Eric Maclean]

Mark
In your original post you where concerned that your intelledrive was show engine shut down turn ON.
I went out today and checked my intelledrive screen and it reads the same as yours does in the picture untill the engine is running and then it updates to engine shut down OFF

So I would not worry about the intelledrive readings
If your getting that screen you should be getting communication from the ECM which tells us the ECM is alive and well

At this point I'd go back to basics
1) rebleed the air from the fuel rail by running the priming pump several times
2) check to make sure you have fuel pressure at the fuel pressure regulator located at the rear of the cylinder head while cranking 60 psi at cranking should be enough.
3) check for air moving through the fuel rail by disconnecting the return line and installing a clear hose to monitor the flow looking for bubbles you should have a clear stream no bubbles.

the next step unfortunately requires Cat ET software or equivalent to check
 4) First check for stored fault codes.
5)  check with cat ET software the fuel injection actuation pressure
If actuation pressure is ok
6) check for injection electronic pulse .

Eric


 

[Dave Atherton]

Mark, may I suggest there is a pig tail on your wiring J-1 ( the connector that go forward to your
key switch. Had this happen several times. Follow wires off your ECM again on J-1 for about 3 feet
and is fastened to frame rail on the passenger side, what you are looking for is a connector that
Wires from up front and wire pig tail of engine ECM join. In this connector there is a red wire that is the
12 volt power to the ECM ( pin 70 ) that will make your engine start and run. When you locate the
Connector take a test light an check for power on both sides on connector for 12 volt. You have everything going for you except no power to fire the injectors. Dave Atherton Retired Cat Mechanic

[Fred Brooks]

   Mark,
Here is something else that I have run into. The coach had an alarm system installed previously that when activated locks out the starter. Even though the alarm may be turned off, when the batteries are changed and 12 volt is restored, the alarm resets itself if it thinks your trying to steal the vehicle. Look for additional wiring coming off the ignition switch that goes to a small module. Fred

[Eric Maclean]

Mark
You may find this interesting.

http://beaveramb.org/forum/index.php?topic=563.0


Eric

[Mark Anderson]

Hey everyone...I really, really appreciate all the feedback and suggestions. 

Dave - when I removed the original ECM I did check voltage at some pins.  I cant remember the exact numbers now for all of them but I do remember checking pin 70.  There was one I checked for constant voltage (good),  one I checked for switched voltage with the key on (good) and 2 grounds.

The new ECM installed I am assuming has a generic 7AS file flashed on to it with some possible RV parameters.  The company I purchased it from asked the type of vehicle and they said they had an RV file.  I have the parameters from my original ECM, which I sent them.  It is a print out from the last time I had my RV in for service with Empire Cat in AZ. But let's assume they did not enter my specific parameters and I just have a generic flashed file in there.  Is there anything that would prevent it from cranking?  And is there anything that is critical to be correct for the engine to run properly?

When I turn the key there is a solenoid in the top of the battery bay that clicks.  I looked at some schematics from a 98 Patriot and it seems that goes to the starter.  I'm guessing if that solenoid is activating, shouldn't it engage the starter? 

[Mark Anderson]

Eric, thank you for checking that for me.  I wont obsess about that engine off: on anymore!  My issue is that it is not cranking at all right now.  I just get a click from that solenoid in the battery compartment.

[Dave Atherton]

Mark, the starter clicks at starter solenoid try this to check something, run. Jumper 12 volt wire from
battery to the small trigger wire on starter see if it solenoid will engage the starter. Note: there is
12 volt on/off running from key switch to pin 70 red wire ( lower left corner bottom on wire harness). Than you have 3 more 12 volt hot wires infused feeding the ECM also along with 4 ground wires going
to ECM also. I assume that what your dealing with is a 70 pin connector. The early 3126 engines have
a 40 pin connector going to the J-1 connection. If you need pin breakout I can lookup the pin wiring
for your engine.       Dave Atherton Retired Cat Mechanic                                                                                                                                                                                                               

[Eric Maclean]

Mark
If I understand correctly your current problem is a no crank condition
First check the rear run switch as it controls both ECM power a d crank signal's
Next
Do you have an read out at the Allison auto shift counsel ( required to give ECM neutral  safety  before ECM will activate crank)
I assume you do or you wouldn't have the click from primary solenoid .
Your unit likely has a 42 MT starter
Check the starter cables both ground and positive feeds and also check the wires connected to the secondary solenoid ( the one on the starter) there should be a ground wire coming off one of the small terminals on the starter going to the ground connection on the starter if it is broken or rotten the solenoid won't work

As Dave explained jump 12+ to the small start signal terminal at the starter if the starter cables are good the engine should
crank be careful under there if the ECM is getting power the engine should run.

[Fred Brooks]

   Mark,
The relay that is clicking in the battery compartment I believe is the "trigger solenoid" that sends the 12 volt signal to the starter solenoid. Do what Dave and Eric are saying. With the key ON jump 12 volt from the batteries over to the starter solenoid directly (smaller terminal). That should engage the starter and then get the engine running.
  To check the operation of the solenoid that is clicking in your battery compartment do the following: With the key off, use your test light and check the stud at the 9:00 position or the 3:00 oclock. One of them should have 12 volt present. When the key is in the start position, the other stud that wasn't hot should NOW have 12 volt and should activate the starter solenoid. Please advise, Fred

[Mark Anderson]

This is interesting...I went to take a picture of the starter to show you and verify I was jumping to the correct place.  Doesn't it look like the wire is out of the connector and just sitting there?  I'll have to check this out further after my class (I am teaching online while I travel).  But that is the wire you wanted me to jump 12v to, correct?

[Eric Maclean]

Mark
Looks like you found the problem
Reconnect the wire and tell us what happens

Eric

[Mark Anderson]

I confirmed it.  That wire was completely out of its crime just sitting on the bolt. 

So I am going to put a new ring terminal on and try it.

Before I do that, I want to confirm with you guys regarding the new ECM that was installed.  The ECM I bought could not be flashed using my old one due to no communication.  So am correct to assume that some generic 7AS file was flashed to it?  Like I said previously, I sent a printout of my old ECM summary to be programmed into it.  But let's assume that was not done.  Will the generic file that was flashed allow my engine to run without damaging it?

Thanks,

Mark

[Eric Maclean]

Mark
Dave can probably answer that better but assuming the file they have downloaded is an appropriate cat program it should at the very least start and run if they down loaded from cat using your serial number it should be good to go.
 the vehicle specific perimeters are the things to look for as being out such as road speed ( dependant on rear gear ratio) and things like fan control (weather it is an ECM controlled cooling fan or not) in your case it is not liking ECM controlled
If you can get it to crank and it has ECM power and grounds it should run barring a fuel or another issue.

Eric

[Mark Anderson]

Thanks Eric...I feeling optimistic. 

I'll update soon.