Electrical Problems

[Jerry Emert]

The adventure begins.  The storage area where I put my coach put in a 30 amp line for me to plug in to.  I plugged it in and didn't notice anything and left.  Had some typical Orlando electrical storms with lots of lightning.  The next day I went to check on some stuff and discovered problems.  I've studied previous issues on the forum but need some advice.  The coach started fine.  Generator started fine but Aladdin indicated no AC.  Some 115 lights (i suspect on the inverter) worked, but dim.  Microwave had no indication of power.    After awhile with the generator running the florescent lights that run down the center of the coach came on full.  I had to put the slide out a foot or so to check the main breakers. Checked breakers that I could find, inverter circuit tripped on the panel in the bedroom closet.  Reset all breakers a couple of times.  Aladdin still showed no AC power but did show charging voltage from solar and (I guess) from the inverter charger, (also started engine at some point so charging may have come from the alternator).  I am not thoroughly familiar yet with all the systems and what works when so I was just doing everything I could think of.  We used to call that easter egg hunting when I was a Navy electronics tech.  
Can't get the slide back in now but I think I just need to get the batteries charged up enough to pull it in.  Batteries show that are drained pretty much all the way through all of this.
I found the transfer switch but didn't have the tools to open it up.  It is mounted in one of the bays with an unmarked gray Box, maybe a junction box, next to it.  The inverter is mounted in the ceiling.  The reset ( I think) button on the inverter was not tripped.  I saw a red light flashing, I think it flashed once then delay then once again, but it stopped so by the time I figured out it was a fault indicator it wasn't doing it anymore.
I hope I'm making sense in my ramblings.  The storage lot electrician of course says that their hook up is fine.  What do you all think?  Electrical hookup?  Lightning?
Any thoughts about what I should check before I call someone to come fix or tow?

Added thoughts:  as I understand the function of a transfer switch. if it goes bad it will still pass 115 through one of the sources such as shore power or genset power.  Which ever it happened to stick on (relay that was closed at the time.)  This does not seem to be passing anything.

In short...HELP!
Thanks for your patience.

[Bob Jae]

Make sure that the "new" 30amp plug is wired for 120volts and not 240volts.  Hopefully you measured it before you plugged in.

[Jerry Emert]

Make sure that the "new" 30amp plug is wired for 120volts and not 240volts.  Hopefully you measured it before you plugged in.

Color me a Dumb A--.  I knew it was done by a licensed electrician and I did not have a meter with long enough leads to go all the way into the metal conductor in the plug.  Expensive lessons are often the best teachers.

[Gerald Farris]

Jerry,
If you are having trouble determining what is wrong with your coach, call me when you have a meter, and get back to your coach. I will walk you through the trouble shooting process.

One thing that I would strongly suggest is installing a Surge Guard, if you do not already have one, to protect your coach from lighting strikes as well as improperly wired shore power plugs.

Gerald

[Jerry Emert]

Jerry,
If you are having trouble determining what is wrong with your coach, call me when you get have a meter, and get back to your coach. I will walk you through the trouble shooting process.

One thing that I would strongly suggest is installing a Surge Guard, if you do not already have one, to protect your coach from lighting strikes as well as improperly wired shore power plugs.

Gerald

Thanks Gerald, I'll call later when I can get there.  I have a 50 amp but the storage lot surprised me and set it up as a 30 amp.  I ordered a 30 amp and it arrives today.  A little late I guess.  

[Jerry Emert]

Update, the storage lot electrician admitted to wiring a 115 leg to the neutral by mistake.  I'm claiming it on my insurance.  As Gerald Knows it fried the shore power side of the transfer switch and most probably the inverter.  My next question is what should I look for in the coach before I close out the claim.  The inverter circuit breaker was tripped but the main was not.  Since the inverter breaker was not quick enough to protect the inverter what else may be fried also?
Any advice or comments are appreciated, thanks again Gerald for going above and beyond by coaching me over the phone.

Jerry

[Karl Welhart]

Jerry,

A friend had a very similar issue happen and many appliances were also damaged in the process.  Check the microwave, a/c's, TV's, DVD player, Aladdin system and Aqua-Hot for problems.  If you replace your inverter/charger, I would recommend the Magnum pure sine wave as a replacement.

[Jerry Emert]

Thanks Karl, the problem blew two fuses to the Aladdin system that I found while trouble shooting.  Once I replace the fuses I'll be able to check it.  I'm worried about all the other stuff you mentioned.  I can't think of a way to test all of that without jumping around the switch and inverter.  I'm not too familiar with the inverter so I'm not even sure where the output is and it's in a tight spot in the overhead.  trying to find a mobil service that can come out and give me an estimate.  Thanks for your thoughts.
Jerry

[Karl Welhart]

Jerry,

Where is your motorhome located?  Also, forgot that my friends Norcold refrigerator's control unit got fried during this event.

[Gerald Farris]

Jerry,
Since your coach received 240 volts from the miss wired box, anything in the coach that operates on 120 volts could have sustained damage. However, you will not be able to check the 120 volt equipment in the coach until you repair the transfer switch, or run jumper wires to bypass it.

As soon as you get 120 volt service into the coach you should be able to determine the extent of the damage. The bypass relays in the inverter will probably still let the 120 volt circuits run through it function even if the inverter has failed. However, you will need to talk to the insurance adjuster before you start replacing items.

Gerald      

[Edward Buker]

Jerry,

This kind of voltage event will produce electronic units that are bad and have failed, units that are damaged and will fail, and units that have tolerated the event and are robust enough that they will not fail. You need to test each electrical item in the coach once you can get the inverter and transfer switch replaced. Once you are back online, things like the TV, run it for a full day, if you have a satellite system or a DVD player, same routine. Things like a microwave you cannot run a day but you can reset the clock and boil water half a dozen times. Put an hour or two on the generator with a load. Basically if a unit has circuitry in it you need to run a test of a rational duration to see if a fail is eminent and that all electrical items still function.

Make a list of what you will be testing, share it with your agent and tell him this is what is needed to replace now to get you online. Once online you will test the remaining electronic items over several weeks. If you get through this test and replace any failing items you should have the vast majority of your problem closed out. Your agent should be happy with an end date and a method to close out your claim. He should understand that you need to run items for some period to test and assure they are not damaged.

Later Ed

[Keith Moffett Co-Admin]

Hey Jerry
I dont claim to be the expert here so there are better opinions than mine.  I did heve a similar expeience once on an older gas coach.  The retiring owner had supplied an extension cord that seemed brand new.  I never thought to check it until I was at a total loss for ideas.  It only looked new and when he rewired the new ends I had 110 on ground.  The chassis was giving low level shocks as was the metal roof.  
In your case since the pwoer was to the neutral which often interacts with the ground bar in the panel, I would be very careful before just ruling out all the 12V system sensors, computers and relays.  Problems there may be less likely but before closing any insurance claim out I would have everything checked or at least call Beaver Coach Sales (1-800-382-2597) and see if their electronics guy had more insight.
Meantime individual units like TV's or Microwaves and so on could be tested off a seperate 110 extension cord run in from outside and plugged in directly.

We are pulling for ya Chief and just know that the other fellas on here know these coaches well.
All our best
Keith and Carol Moffett

[Edward Buker]

Jerry,

Keith is right and I should have been a little clearer when I said test everything with circuitry. The neutral and grounds may be tied together somewhere in these coaches which means the frame of the coach would have seen 120V AC swings when referenced to the +12V DC on the DC side of the electronics. That is not to say that anything is bad, just it should all be tested and run to be sure everything is working. The fewer things that are bad that you find, the better you should feel about all this as far as what may have been damaged.

later Ed

[LarryNCarolynShirk]

Until your coach is operational, you could run an extension cord to most of the appliances individually to test them one at a time.

Larry

[Mark Beighley]

Gerald and others...
As a learning experience...would a Surge Guard have protected the system components from damage in this situation?  I operated last year without one and I'm now learning that was a big mistake.  Fortunately I suffered no damage but it seems, at $300, like a cheap piece of insurance for my 90 vintage Beav.  Also, will a 50amp Surge Guard provide the same protection if plugged into a 30 amp service using an adapter?  I was in several parks last summer where the only available spaces were 30 amp.  I used the adapter and everything worked fine as long as I only ran 1 AC unit.