BAC Forum
General Boards => Technical Support => Topic started by: Rick Penick on September 15, 2020, 07:58:22 PM
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I tested it had juice on one side not the other side . i jumped it and engine started. so i took it off need to get new one where would you recommend i get one?
Rick
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Rick,
It is the starter solenoid. It should be chassis battery "hot" on one side and when you turn the ignition key to the start position, the small post on the solenoid should become 12 volt hot momentarily and engage the solenoid so the other post becomes "hot" going to the started. I would replace it if defective with a Cole- Hersey continuous duty rating above 500 amps. Sorry I don't have a part number. Perhaps someone will chime in with a part number. Hope this helps, Fred
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Ok great! would be nice to have a part number..
Thank you
Rick
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I did a quick look i see nothing that is 500 amp . Found one looks just like what i have at oreilly 85 amps.
Rick
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Found this on amazon 200 amp highest i have seen. What is the reason for 500 amps?
Thx Rick
https://www.amazon.com/HERSEE-TERMINAL-CONTINUOUS-SOLENOID-24213BX/dp/B00FGJIJR6/ref=pd_day0_263_3/140-1369159-0851517?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00FGJIJR6&pd_rd_r=1fe5b073-49d6-447a-acce-e541d368fd04&pd_rd_w=sU5iy&pd_rd_wg=aQja2&pf_rd_p=a59dd86a-4de1-429e-a396-2293f5f62529&pf_rd_r=MZMR6EVM893NN5BQXTJE&psc=1&refRID=MZMR6EVM893NN5BQXTJE
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http://beaveramb.org/forum/index.php/topic,10072.msg68624.html#msg68624
http://beaveramb.org/forum/index.php/topic,4388.msg33179.html#msg33179
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Rick,
The problem here is that Fred was talking about a starter solenoid like this; https://www.ebay.com/i/264148579459?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-213727-13078-0&mkcid=2&itemid=264148579459&targetid=4580290572086399&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=&poi=&campaignid=403204655&mkgroupid=1227055191472610&rlsatarget=pla-4580290572086399&abcId=9300377&merchantid=51291&msclkid=ee79662022c71a525f9339417f577fbd
and you are talking about your boost solenoid or salesman switch solenoid.
If it was the boost solenoid and there was 12v on only one side, you had a dead battery bank, and bypassing it tied your battery banks together to start the coach. If that is the case, there is probably nothing wrong with the solenoid because it should not be engaged unless you are holding down the boost switch.
You need to familiarize yourself with the coach and its systems before you seriously cause damage or injury. There are several club members in the Tucson or Phoenix area that would be willing to give you a walk through and answer your questions.
Gerald
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Rick, If you live in Tucson, I would give you a "show coach" for free. Fred
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Rick,
Before you spend$ consider that the boost solenoid will not have voltage on both sides until the Boost switch in the cockpit is pushed. Your jumpering of the solenoid effectively jumpered the switch. If you haven't yet, try starting the engine with the boost switch pushed. If it starts, you most likely have discharged chassis batteries that are causing the no start problem.
Steve
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OK ,
So i replaced the batteries with new ones die hard commercial group 31 batteries . I took them out had them tested said they were bad. I bought this coach at rv park in showlow az. I been trying to get it to tucson since i bought it. So if solenoid is not bad than why would it start when i jumped it and show power on only one side with brand new batteries installed? I do appreciate the help here but i am in showlow not phx or tucson wish i was but not the case i want to get coach home so i can work on it etc. I am not interested in getting experimented on by some one i dont know when this could be something simple.
Rick
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I tested it had juice on one side not the other side . i jumped it and engine started. so i took it off need to get new one where would you recommend i get one?
Rick
What solenoid did you jump? Where is it located?
On my '05 Coach there is a "starter solenoid" located on the starter as you would expect, and a second solenoid mounted on the chassis above that (which takes the power from the ignition switch and applies that to the solenoid on the starter). I had to replace that chassis solenoid (which is a "momentary duty" solenoid) when my Coach would not start.
Then there is the 12V "continuous duty" solenoid in the front run bay which powers up half of the circuit breakers (some of which feed the engine and transmission ECMs).
And the 12V Coach power solenoid/relay (a.k.a. Salesmen's Switch) which is mostly for interior 12V lighting.
Then there is the BigBoy solenoid (which you probably don't have on a '97) that is used for battery charging, and to connect House and Chassis batteries together when you press the "Boost" button. However you probably have a boost solenoid used to connect the House and Chassis batteries together to assist starting (I assume you have the DUVAC charging system)
This diagram (frm the Coach Assist section) should be your setup (for a '97) or very close to it.
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Rick,
I'm assuming you jumped the start boost solenoid and that you jumpered the 2 large terminals on the top of it. One of those terminals should have house battery voltage and the other has chassis battery voltage. When the boost switch is pushed the solenoid closes and the ties the batteries together to provide max amperage to the starter. We don't have a 97 diagram but the 96 copy shows that both chassis and house battery connections come from from the battery isolator. The chassis battery is a direct connection to the chassis battery stud on the isolator. The house battery connection comes from an aluminum terminal bar that is connected to the house battery stud on the isolator. Verify you have 12v on both chassis and house studs on the isolator. The 96 diagram shows the isolator, aluminum bar and boost solenoid all on the isolator board.
Steve
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update ...so the airbags are up and working. the compressor tank had a leak at the pressure relief valve seems ok now. as far as the coach goes two new 6 volt batteries installed and two new chassis group 31 die hard. so the problem is coach not starting turning the key. tried turning key and pushing boost switch nothing happens. also the dash will have hazard lights blinking etc. when you turn the key or if you close the door and step retracts the hazard light blink than eventually go off. tested the solenoid back by the engine had someone push the button to boost from chassis batteries no 12 v on the side going to the engine. tried button inside the back compartment nothing. so that is where i stand at this point if i jump the back solenoid engine starts...once running i still have check engine light but looking at monitor dont see anything serious that stands out
i also checked the smaller wires off the solenoid drivers side front i get like 3 volts back boost solenoid about same plus all the wires are white confusing also.thinking about replacing both solenoids. i appreciate everyones help on this i can build a house but new gig for me..
Rick
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Fred,
You are hell of a guy i wish i had this in tucson i am sure i be done by now. when i do get it to tucson would like to meet up.
thank you for your input.
rick
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Rick, Thanks for the kind words, my email is in my profile. Maybe I'll see you in the future. Fred
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Rick,
Difficult to assist you without more info. Is the solenoid you are worried about the boost (will have cables running to battery isolator) or the starter solenoid (will have cable running to starter). You didn't say if there was 12v at the isolator, so ?? Have you tried tracing the cable that has no voltage on it? The 96 diagrams are on Coach Assist. Look for the 96 Monterey wiring diagrams contributed by John Bronson and Connie Bradish or the 96 Patriot wiring diagrams contributed by Connie Bradish
Steve
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Rick,
As Steve and the rest of us out here in forum land are trying to help you, a picture is worth a thousand words. If you would help us out, take a picture of the device you are discussing and then re-size it so it is less than 300kb so you can attach it to your post.
Thanks, Fred
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Would anyone possibly have the boost solenoid number for 1997 monterey?
thanks rick
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I hav spent days on this in the dirt. so where i am is i turn the key engine wont start i have tested all the connections in the fuse area . The solenoid in fuse area you turn the key on i get 12v on right side key off no 12v on right side coming in on left hav 12v. i go back to the solenoid mounted on frame behind battery bank and i get 12v in nothing out towards engine. i have tried pushing the boost switch with key turned on nothing. I have the bed up tested everything in sight. I tested all fuses in and around the batteries etc all good.there is a blue isolator box has fins on it a black wire goes to it and another black wire goes to the batteries 6v. I do not no if the isolator assuming i am calling it correctly can be tested or not. the solenoid back by the batteries i can jump across it and engine fires right up.
the dash i hav been under it cant find any issues that are obvious there has been no rats etc in the wiring. also the small wire on the solenoid in the front going to back solenoid i hav no power . someone mentioned that it should have 12 v to start. when i start the engine i get check engine light on i get engine warning light on . another thing is the hazard lights come on by themselves start blinking no clue what that is about.so called race car buddy we went back and forth on the phone he says the solenoid back by batteries is bad needs replaced i asked here if anyone new what the part number or anything about what it is i need. there is no numbers or info on it. so if anyone has any ideas i am listening. pictures etc are big help. if anyone thinks they can help appreciate it. will leave my cell number 520 419 8828.
thanks
rick
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You need to provide a photo of what your working on - so we can be sure that the advice given is correct. When you say "fuse area" are you talking about the compartment at the front of the Coach, or back at the rear by the batteries?
Is this what your rear run/elec panel looks like? This layout shows the Boost solenoid.
But with new chassis batteries you should not need to use the Boost solenoid. I think the terminology you are using to describe some of the components may be incorrect and thereby adding some confusion regarding what you are doing (working on) in your troubleshooting steps.
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Rick,
With all due respect, I think you are at the point where you provide us with some photos of your suspected problem areas (third time we have requested this) and/or call a mobile RV tech. As Mike noted, we are "shooting in the dark" when trying to advise you as we are not sure what you are referring to. Since you said that the coach had been sitting for some time, it is very possible that it has multiple issues. I (we) have asked specific questions regarding to help you ID the problem(s). For example, I asked if you had house and chassis battery voltage on the large studs of the isolator. No answer. As Fred noted, we are trying to help but w/o answers to our specific questions it is impossible for us to be of value to you. This is doubly important in the case of someone not familiar with RVs.
Steve
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Rick
With the key in the run position do you have any numbers or lights on the shift console if not the transmission ECM will not be sending a neutral signal to the engine ECM and with out the neutral safety the engine won't crank if the console is dead check for a ten amp fuse located in the battery box area at the rear in the rats next of battery cables there should be two of them one for the engine ECM and the other for the transmission ECM these will be regular sealed ATO inline fuse holders.
Let me know what you find
Eric
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Hey Eric,
I just got off the phone with Rick and we have traced the issue to the alarm system is still active in this coach. Markers flash and ignition is by-passed. We are in the process of uninstalling it. Thanks to everyone who is trying to help. Blessings and Joy, Fred
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Hey Eric,
I just got off the phone with Rick and we have traced the issue to the alarm system is still active in this coach. Markers flash and ignition is by-passed. We are in the process of uninstalling it. Thanks to everyone who is trying to help. Blessings and Joy, Fred
Nice work Fred!
We were pretty far off track on our group troubleshooting efforts.
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Mike,
Not really, we are all collectively trying to help this newbee out and he has no idea how to use the nomenclature we are all familiar with. On top of all that his camera on his phone is busted so he can't take pictures and post them.
I appreciate you doing the research and posting the original schematic for his coach. Keep up the good work! Fred
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Good work Fred
With the uninstall the start circuit should be reunited and all will be good we hope!
Makes perfect sense with the lights tied in.
Did he find the alarm unit ( probably under the dash somewhere near the ignition switch)
Any way good call Fred I hope your handy when I need ya lol
Happy travels Eric
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I want to thank Fred and Steve and Roy i finally got the rig started. I had wires crossed on the solenoid and Steve helped me test those and got them all hooked up correctly. Also the alarm i took apart pulled checked all fuses and replaced the relay found a key in a drawer with a key faub went to Ace Hdwe bought a new battery 12v believe it or not and got the alarm shutoff. Than she fired up! Now on to check engine light on and wobble in front end which is unreal aired up tires checked the hubs oil levels etc etc so made appt to place up here Steve recommended had to wait a week to get in.
Thanks again and thanks for your patience!
Rick