BAC Forum
General Boards => Technical Support => Topic started by: Terry Whiteley on November 19, 2019, 01:57:54 AM
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2005 Beaver Huntington IV
Cat C9, 400 hp, Allison6 spd
4 slides
Mfd date 5/2005
Order # 111684
Chassis: Magnum although the tag says Roadmaster RM8
Toad: 2012 F150 with 2wheel drive with field modified driveshaft by Drive Shaft King-Dallas and Toad Braking System- by M&G Engineering - Athens Texas
The threads have disappeared from inside the fuel filter neck bowl thus making impossible to screw a cap back on. The threads are not jammed on the cap. I have searched high and low and can not find anything
thanks Terry
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Terry, is this coach new to you?
Just wondering if the threads were "never there" (a manufacturing defect) - I don't see how they could wear off as the fuel filler is such a low use item and even then only subject to hand tightening.
I believe your Monterey has fuel filling on both sides. If it does, how does the other side look?
Also, you said the "threads are inside the filler neck". On my coach the threads are on the outside of the filler neck (the fuel cap has the threads internal). Maybe I'm wrong on this - my memory is foggy on this now.
This is a real puzzle.
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Terry,
The title of your post states fuel filler neck. The text refers to the fuel filter neck bowl. Is one a typo?
Thx, Steve
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I have owned the 38 ft Beaver for 3 years. My threads on both sides are inside where the cap screws into the “filler pipe”.
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I think Beaver changed the location of the fuel filler neck in 2006, to eliminate the foaming fuel spills. They put the filler down low, directly connected to the tank, like on a big rig fuel tank, If I remember correctly. If so, the cap would have inside threads (female) and the filler neck would have male threads.
When fueling my Beaver, I have to hold the nozzle open manually the whole time (20 minutes or more) or it will shut off due to foaming. Long fuel hose from filler neck to tank is to blame.
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I just came across Terry's thread in another forum. He is talking about the "Filler Neck".
Terry posted these photos - I hope it's okay for me to repost them here. The photos help to understand the problem.
There are replacement Filler Necks available - you just need to have the specs (length, pipe diameter, etc.)
such as https://www.fillernecksupply.com/2-universal-fuel-filler-neck-gas-engine/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI8fH_zcv25QIVjJOzCh3xnAfhEAQYASABEgIh4PD_BwE
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Bingo... yes those pics are ok to use as shows my dilemma...that makes total sense I can see why Beaver changed it in 06...as I must stand there holding the diesel nozzle but it does foam & sometimes pops out of the hole ...I would wonder how to install a replacement filler neck/sleeve/bowl...
2005 Beaver Huntington IV
400 hp C9 caterpillar
F150 2wheel drive with Driveshaft Disconnect by Driveshaft King- Dallas Toad braking system - M and G Engineering Athens Texas
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Terry,
From the pics it looks like the cap was sealed to the filler pipe with silicone or similar sealant and that the filler pipe was replaced by a PO and possibly was intended for a push style cap. https://carlisuspension.com/product/dodge/ram-1500/1500-components/billet-fuel-cap/ rather than a threaded one. In any case, I would think the filler pipe could be replaced by any competent truck repair or welding shop. It is not a DIY job IMHO.
Steve
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The cap was Not sealed to the filler tube. The cap was free to unscrew and screw back in after filling.
I am having difficulty attaching pics to my threads and have downsized the pics with no success.
For those of you who wish to assist me further please send me an email request and I will send an email with the pics which Cleary show the problem with the drivers side filler tube.
twz4@hotmail.com
Terry Whiteley
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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Could the threads still be attached to the cap? Was the cap screwed on so tight that when it was unscrewed, the threads stuck to it? Just guessing....
On second thought, after reading your original post, I guess that did not happen.
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Roy,
IMHO I think you are on the right track. Threaded inserts are available for diesel fill pipes. See https://www.fillernecksupply.com/threaded-diesel-fuel-cap-neck-insert-for-commercial-truck-stop-pump-fill-pipe/?gclid=CjwKCAiAws7uBRAkEiwAMlbZjgtf4fIukwSjAkSypzFBBAEfkrRh_fhpEOVmrA3mnDoDCvV72yM1dxoCvR8QAvD_BwE
Again, IMHO one can see the remnants of some sort of sealant on the edge of the fill pipe in the photos Mike posted. It seems possible that the sealant failed, allowing the insert to come out with the cap at some point. In any case, the good news is that it appears the inserts are available at low cost. Obviously the attachment medium is critical so the insert doesn't fail again.
Steve
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Thank you Steve and Ray what is IHMO stand for? It indeed would be ideal to find an insert/ or a bowl with inside threads.
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In My Humble Opinion
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Awe shucks...That was easy
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Folks I got a response from Filter Neck Supply which looks like it will solve my problem ...thanks everyone for caring enough to respond
https://www.fillernecksupply.com/threaded-diesel-fuel-cap-neck-insert-for-commercial-truck-stop-pump-fill-pipe/
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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That's a "weld in" filler neck. Are you sure that is the correct type.
I though the filler neck on our coached used a flange to "bolt it" to the body then the hose clamped on to that.
More like this. Maybe I'm wrong.
But weld-in is okay if you can remove the existing assembly and take it to a welding shop.
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Probably “bolt on” would be ok but not sure how to do that. I asked filter neck supply for something that would fit inside my 2” OD filler pipe. I am quite certain I will have to remove the filler pipe from
the fuel door area and take apart the fuel line leading down towards the fuel tank then have the new Diesel Fuel Cap Neck Insert For Fill Pipe welded in. I suppose I might also be able to epoxy the Diesel Fuel Cap Neck Insert In as well...
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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I'm not 100% sure, but I thought the filler neck was about 10 inches long (solid tube) with four bolts/screws that hold it into the body opening and then the flexible hose going to the tank clamped to that.
If you scrape away some of the calking/sealer around the filler neck you would see those bolts/screws - if they are used.
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I did scrape away all the epoxy and there are 3 screws holding it. My filler pipe starts out with about 1” straight then turns down at about a 60 -75 degree angle then goes almost straight for about 2 feet till it ties into what appears to be an insulated flexible line heading toward the fuel tank...I have not removed it yet because I wanted to be see what was available for an insert into the filler plus be able to drive the coach to a repair facility if needed. I am very appreciative of all the input. i’m just not sure I personally want to mess with the fuel line etc.
Thanks
Terry
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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Terry,
Be sure to verify where the filler tube goes into the tank. Some Beavers had the tube entering the tank at about the 3/4 point on the side of the tank, rather than at the top. If your tank has fuel above that point, it could get messy....
Steve
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Define “ Could get messy“ please...
Thanks
Terry
BAC
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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I think he means that if your fuel level is higher than the opening on the fuel filler, the tank may empty out of the neck! Messy!!
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Jerry, Terry,
Yes, that is what I was referring to.
Steve
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Gerald, Steve, etal...On my 90 Marquis the fuel inlet behind the door is an opening only for a auto fill pump. What do I have to do to enlarge the opening in order to use the truck pumping area without having to hold the pump handle.
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Mandy everyone else I am purchasing a threaded diesel filler insert which fits inside my fuel filler pipe inlet
Filler neck Supply have some diesel inserts it will need to be welded in, to see it CLICK Below
https://www.fillernecksupply.com/threaded-diesel-fuel-cap-neck-insert-for-commercial-truck-stop-pump-fill-pipe/
They also sell the green diesel cap
Sales: Dustin Squires
Filler Neck Supply Co.
10020 E Montgomery Ave
Bldg #2
Spokane Valley Wa 99206
www.fillernecksupply.com
Phone 888-239-8833
Mandy you would need to detach the filler pipe from inside the fuel door which should have 3 screws. Then disconnect the fuel line probably connected to flexible fuel line which connect to the fuel tank below. I am not a welder so I’m taking it to a local repair shop that I’ve done business with and he’ll weld the insert to the inside of the fuel filler pipe and then will be able to reconnect to the flexible fuel line and then screw back the filler pipe with the Threaded insert to the fuel door area.***I will advise everyone how the process went for future RV owners with similar problems have similar problems.
Terry
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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Mandy,
If I understand your question correctly, changing the inlet size won't fix the problem IMHO. The major issue is the size of the fill pipe and inlet to the tank. The cross sectional area is not large enough to accommodate the volume of fuel that is introduced by a pump with the handle nozzle on full. Going to a truck nozzle will make the problem worse as it will try to force even more fuel down the pipe. Another issue may also be at play. On many of the older coaches, the fill port into the tank was located 25% to 40% below the top of the tank. This was necessary to achieve a gravity assisted flow because the tank was mounted relatively high in the chassis in relation to the fill door. Thus, at some point fuel is not emptying into the tank above the existing level of the fuel in the tank, but is being added below the level of the fuel in the tank, restricting the amount of fuel one can push down the fill pipe w/o significant back pressure/ fuel backup.
Gerald may have more accurate info on this.
Steve
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Now I get it Steve...it makes sense why fueling is so restricted & slow. I would say my previous owner knew this and thus changed the opening size of the inlet thinking it would improve fueling.
Terry
05 Beaver Monterey Huntington IV 38’
4 Slides
CAT 400 hp C9
F150 2wheel drive
with driveshaft disconnect and M & G Braking System
Owned for 3 years
East Texas
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Mandy,
Steve is right about the reason that refueling your coach is at restricted flow rate. To modify your coach so that you can refuel from a truck pump without having to hold the handle at a slow rate would probably require moving the fuel tank to a more accessible location like a basement compartment location similar to the one used by Monaco in some of the later model coaches.
Gerald
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Forget it!!!
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Terry as for as the slow fueling and foaming goes I used to use small wooden wedge to regulate the fuel flow so I didn’t have to hold the fuel nozzle. Last spring I went to a muffler with the coach. They bent some two inch exhaust pipe to replace the fuel filler hose. With the exhaust pipe in place the foaming has been reduced by 80 percent or more and the fuel flow is better. I think the filler hose churns the fuel causing the foaming. The panel below the filler is attached like a cargo bay door. Unbolt it at the bottom and it swings up and you can see the filler hose. With the fuel tank at half or less you can remove the filler hoses. I had the pipe bent so that I had only an inch or so clearance. Using six inches of new hose On each end I installed the pipe.
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Appreciate the response but I am Not sure I fully understand your fix using exhaust pipe in place of the filler pipe and did you have the guy welding insert and add in a new filler pipe Insert that was threaded? and the wedge... when I have used my fingers to squeeze in the nozzle it generally stops flowing because I have depressed slightly past the point where the fuel shuts off the flow.
Terry
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Terry the best thing I’ve done for the foaming and and slow fueling was to replace the filler hose from the neck to the tank with exhaust pipe. If you have questions Email me at roys.inbox@sbcglobal.net.