BAC Forum
General Boards => Technical Support => Topic started by: Fred Cook on June 22, 2025, 01:09:10 AM
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I currently have a C 12 motor and looking at buying a coach with a C 13. It is a 2008 model. What are the drawbacks of the 2008 C13 motor and should I not even consider buying it?
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It will consume more fuel. 6-6.5 MPG at best. If that does not bother you, then the extra power is nice but it will not be that much different than what you have. My 02’ Marquis had the C-12, great motor, probably the best of the big CAT motors in my opinion. All that being said, if you like the floor plan and more slides, then go for it. My 07’ Marquis has four slides and the extra room is amazing. It really depends on what you want if you upgrade. Do your homework, be informed with the different equipment, then make a decision. Hope this helps, good luck!!
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Thanks Frank. My biggest concern is that the 2008 C13 may be a regen motor….. not sure. I have seen posts on other forums where people have had issues with the cat regen motor. Was wondering if any owners of the C13 have had any issues with their motor.
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The CAT ARD Head was mandated in 2007-2009. The C-13 that you are looking at was more than likely manufactured before that. You can get the serial number for that motor and contact any CAT shop and verify when it was manufactured. Then you will know for sure what you are dealing with. Hope this helps!!
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Fred,
Here is a C13 Serial number prefix chart (generally used by Monaco):
Prefix: KCB
Model: C13 ACERT
Years: 2004-2006
Prefix: LEE
Model: C13 ACERT (regen)
Years: 2007-2010
The ‘LEE’ engines will have the ARD Head and other additional troublesome emissions devices.
Also, not sure which model coach that you are looking at but be aware that some 2008 and up Marquis and Patriot Thunder utilize a Chassis Control Module (CCM). You should research this, keywords are Kongsberg, Megatech, Mega Tech, Chassis Control Module, CCM.
Our 2006 Patriot Thunder has a ‘KCB’ C13 ACERT. We’ve had a few issues with it but nothing serious. Water pump (replacement is not for the faint of heart) and problems with the variable valve timing (VVA). As Fank mentioned, the C13 is quite thirsty, I’ve never seen better than 6 mpg.
I wouldn’t shy away from a ‘KCB’ C13, but only after a heath check by a certified CAT Tech. Include an oil analysis if the oil has not been recently changed.
-Scott
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2004 Beaver Marquis Sapphire - 6 to 6.5 mpg would be an improvement over our C-12, 505 hp engine, but we are usually pushing 48,500 lbs around - the coach at 42,000 lbs plus the toad at 6,500 lbs. We have averaged approximately 5.25 mpg over 45,000 miles of driving, which includes diesel usage by the 12.5 kW generator. We don't use the big generator all that much because the toad carries a gasoline Honda 3000w that is usually used unless we are running the coach's A/Cs while traveling in hot weather. The Honda generator will run for 16+ hours on a 3.6-gallon fill of gasoline.
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Thanks guys for your replies. The motor has a prefix of LEE. So, I guess it must be a regen or an ARD. The coach is beautiful with four slides, and our current coach with the C 12 only has two slides. I am a little worried that the ARD head would be a bad decision.
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Fred
We have the 07 C13. It is currently in at CAT for head work. Ours is not the regen going by the serial number. I do thing ours is a left over 2006. Still the CAT guy took one look and knew. I understand from talking to the mechanic here that there is now a fix.
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Just curious… is it illegal to delete the emissions stuff off the C13?
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Fred,
Yes, it is a federal violation of The Clean Air Act (likely a state violation too) to remove or disable any pollution control device on your Cat engine.
The non-regen ACERT used a catalytic muffler (DOC), so technically, replacing the muffler with a non-catalytic muffler would be a violation. California owners are experiencing this with their new inspection regulations.
Here’s an old Caterpillar YouTube video ‘showcasing’ the pre-regen ACERT technology (there are other videos out there).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djWN_HGYbF0
Keith,
What’s going on with your C13? What kind of head work are they having to do?
-Scott
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Fred,
Yes, it is a federal violation of The Clean Air Act (likely a state violation too) to remove or disable any pollution control device on your Cat engine.
The non-regen ACERT used a catalytic muffler (DOC), so technically, replacing the muffler with a non-catalytic muffler would be a violation. California owners are experiencing this with their new inspection regulations.
Here’s an old Caterpillar YouTube video ‘showcasing’ the pre-regen ACERT technology (there are other videos out there).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djWN_HGYbF0
Keith,
What’s going on with your C13? What kind of head work are they having to do?
-Scott
Well, I don’t own it yet. Been thinking about buying a 2008 Patriot Thunder lately. It’s the C13, 525 HP with ARD head (Regen motor). It’s a beautiful coach. Based on some things I have heard and read about this motor, I’m feeling a bit uneasy about buying it. I was hoping to get some feedback on this forum from others you own the same motor.
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Fred,
If you haven't yet, I'd suggest speaking to a couple of CAT mechanics from different shops to get their views/advice. Engine issues can get expensive real quick. Also may want to use Ask Dave feature to get his input.
Steve