BAC Forum
General Boards => Technical Support => Topic started by: Bill Sprague on October 29, 2014, 01:56:17 PM
-
At the beginning of the Maintenance Round-table at the Kerrville rally a couple weeks ago there was discussion of oil analysis.
Since then, I have run samples of both my engine oil and transmission fluid through the lab. It is the second time I've done it. When I started, my primary motivation was the idea that I might be able to spot any coolant in the transmission fluid before it did any damage. At the time, Tim Bentley was have a transmission replaced.
Attached are .jpg copies of the .pdf file that was emailed to me. Clicking on them seems to make them easy enough to read. The original is much better and I can email it to you if your interested. Blackstone provides a guide for reading their reports here: http://www.blackstone-labs.com/report-explanation.php
Essentially, the engine oil report confirms it is time to change my oil and the transmission report suggests it is not necessary to replace the Transynd.
-
Thanks for sharing Bill. I Would bet your day was a little brighter after reviewing these reports!
Dan
-
Bill
Looks like you do this annualy? I would like to know how the samples are taken and the quantity used. Also what kind of container is used like a test tube or whatever and where that is available?
Seperately I have been considering changing to Transend but I did so on the old coach and it shifted very hard afterward. Do you have an opinion on any of this?
Thanks
Keith
-
Many of you use Blackstone for your analyses. I have had just as good results using http://www.jglubricantservices.com/ at a lower cost. I have no stake in this, I just want people to know that there are qualified alternatives to Blackstone.
-
Bill
Looks like you do this annualy? I would like to know how the samples are taken and the quantity used. Also what kind of container is used like a test tube or whatever and where that is available?
Seperately I have been considering changing to Transend but I did so on the old coach and it shifted very hard afterward. Do you have an opinion on any of this?
Thanks
Keith
Keith,
I've only started doing it and my first two samples are about a year apart. I might do it twice a year to keep an eye on the transmission. It may be groundless, but I developed a fear of transmission repair or replacement caused by radiator failures.
Blackstone mails you the test kits for free. The small bottles are about three ounces. Blackstone sells a suction pump for about $30 that can be used to extract fluid. The small bottle screws to the pump and about 6 feet of ordinary 1/4 inch plastic tubing threads through the pump into the bottle. You put the tubing down the dip stick hole, pump a few times and the bottle fills. It is very easy and very clean.
The sample kit includes legal USPS packaging for the liquid sample container and an addressed outer container. If you need it, Blackstone will provide a copy of a letter from the USPS for you to show the local post office that it is OK to ship the liquid.
You send a check or credit card number with the sample for $25. In about a week you get the results by email.
I don't know how you tell if one lab is better, or of a better value, than another. Transmissions can cost $10,000 or more to repair. For me, the $25 per sample seems OK.
I have no answer about Transynd and shifting as our came with it. I have nothing to compare to. If I remember right, you bought a newer motorhome not long ago. I would be surprised if it didn't also come with Transynd.
I'll show you the kit when we go clamming. I have two spare (free) sample kits. We can take samples of yours if you want.
-
Many of you use Blackstone for your analyses. I have had just as good results using http://www.jglubricantservices.com/ at a lower cost. I have no stake in this, I just want people to know that there are qualified alternatives to Blackstone.
Joel,
I looked up JG Lubricant Services. They have a $21 kit, a $27 kit and a $40 kit. I don't know how to compare them to the $25 price from Blackstone.
Somebody told me that Speedco will do them and I've read where Allison service dealers will do them too.
I have absolutely no idea how to figure out if one is better than another.
-
Keith,
re Shifting; we changed to Transynd with our 01 Contessa (Allison 3000 series) and the effect (smoother, more positive shifting/no searching) was very noticeable. We put Transynd in the Marquis (Allison 4000 series) but saw no noticeable difference. PO's records didn't specify fluid type at previous change but cost indicates it was Dextron. Marquis shifted smoothly pre and post change-over.
Steve
-
We recieved no maintenance log from the PO when we bought the new coach last year. Now I think about it it could have been changed to Transynd already. We are slowly doing all the maintenance from scratch just so we know where we stand.
Thanks Bill and Steve.
-
Keith,
If you are not sure about your transmission fluid, I would definitely have a fluid analysis run. It is a lot cheaper than changing the transmission fluid, and then you will know more about the fluid than you would if you had records.
Gerald
-
So as a new owner to an old Beaver, after getting our coach last August, I had just about all the major fluids and filters replaced in February 2014. I did not have an exact maintenance record to go by from the previous owner(s) so thought it safest to just do it all.
We typically use our coach for short weekend trips usually once a month and by the time February rolls around again I will suspect we will have put maybe 2500-3000 miles on it at most since all the fluids were done.
My questions is now with the ability to have these fluids tested by these labs, should I stick to the once a year oil change regardless of miles or rather send a sample and see if the oil is still of usable quality before having it changed out? Same question with the new Transynd that was put in, but obviously that would not be a yearly change out anyways but maybe worth a yearly test.
-
Matt,
If you listen to Caterpillar, they will tell you to change the engine yearly, regardless of the low mileage. However, my opinion is that if an oil analysis comes back with good reading on the oil condition, I would not change it with such low usage.
Gerald
-
CAT advised me to change oil based on fuel consumed. For the 3126B they recommended changing oil after burning 1100 gal of fuel. That worked out to about 7700 miles.
Steve
-
Thanks Gerald and Steve. I think you likely just saved me a few hundred bucks. I think i'll do the lab analysis on both the oil and tranny just to have a baseline, especially for the tranny that might go several years without need for a change. If I can do the engine oil every other year based on our limited use at the moment that'd be great.
-
I have been doing every other year. I change it and we do 3K miles the first summer, the second summer it is 6K miles and then we change it as soon as we get home. That is a few more miles then I like between changes but it is mostly all interstate with little idle time. Just can't bring myself to change the oil at 3K miles without a real need. We have been doing this the last 4 years and we use no oil between changes of shell rottella 15w40. We have the synthetic blend in it now. I always use a Cat High efficiency oil filter which is a different PN then the original one in the manual.
Later Ed
-
I have been doing every other year. I change it and we do 3K miles the first summer, the second summer it is 6K miles....
I've started to apply the same logic to my Hydro-Hot. I run it frequently enough that the fuel doesn't turn to jelly or what ever it does with lack of use. If the exhaust stays clear, I extend the annual service interval to something convenient. Replacing a clean and underused filter and nozzle with ones only a little less used does not make sense.
So far, none of my Hydro Hot failures had anything to do with nozzles, filters, adjustments or inspectable items.
-
Joel,
I looked up JG Lubricant Services. They have a $21 kit, a $27 kit and a $40 kit. I don't know how to compare them to the $25 price from Blackstone.
Somebody told me that Speedco will do them and I've read where Allison service dealers will do them too.
I have absolutely no idea how to figure out if one is better than another.
Blackstone charges $10 for TAN and TBN analyses. The last time I checked these were included in the basic JG analysis. TAN is important in evaluation Transynd fluid; TBN is important in oil analysis.
-
Bill
By the way thanks very much for the offer on the test samples. I got the oil and filter done in August and its the blended synthetic so that should be fine for some time. I do want to test the ATF this spring but I hope to have all that done ahead of next summer. I may have questions though!
Keith
-
If you are on the road and need an oil change you can't beat Speedco, they have locations nation wide and are very thorough. Their basic oil change includes a lube, check all chassis fluids, check tire pressures, and an on the spot oil analysis. The whole process takes about 45 minutes and you don't need to unhook your tow vehicle.
They do not however, pay any attention to the rest of your coach, not a good idea to use Speedco for all your oil changes.
-
Tim,
I'm not sure what you mean by that last statement. What other things might another shop do for an oil change/lube?
Larry
-
I have been testing all of my vehicles for several years now. I installed a Fumato valve on each vehicle, including the Beaver and send a sample off with each oil change on most of them, particularly the diesels. So far, I have been alerted with a buiding problem in a 6.0 Powerstroke Diesel in a F250, which I no longer possess, and was very happy to have a solid track record of oil changes and engine condition in the Contessa when the engine blew at 19,000 miles. I was able to provide the repair shop with copies of the test results, which showed absloutely no issues, when the coach was towed into Fairbanks. Cummins never questioned the warranty coverage. It's cheap piece of mind.
-
Tim,
I'm not sure what you mean by that last statement. What other things might another shop do for an oil change/lube?
Larry
If you go to a complete beaver service center they will inspect your coach and maybe find a problem that needs attention. Speedco just looks at the chassis.
-
You must be talking about BCS. I think most other RV shops don't do that as part of a lube unless you pay extra for a coach inspection, right? I know that's the way it was for my old non-Beaver coach at my local dealer. They never came up with anything else wrong as part of a lube.