BAC Forum
General Boards => Technical Support => Topic started by: Michael Hannan on January 31, 2016, 02:10:26 AM
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I wasn't always this slow when it comes to understanding but I guess old age is setting in so please forgive the simplicity of my question. I am a full time camper and because of rising prices at my present campground, I am moving to another. The new site however only has 30amp service. I understand that this will have a major impact on my power use in particular with air & heat pump units maybe not running on 30 amp service. During periods of high load with air, TV, coffee maker going, can I just turn the generator on to pick up the extra load? Do I need to disconnect from shore power first?
Thanks for any help.
MJ
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The short answer is NO. Others can explain it better and more accurately than me, but I think we have access to one source (your generator) or the other source (shore power), but not both at once.
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Ok. Thanks for that. If I need more power than the shore power can give I'll unplug and start the generator then turn on what I need.
MJ
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Michael,
The way that your coach is wired, the incoming A/C power connects to the coach wiring through the transfer switch. The transfer switch is a generator priority unit. In other words, it will connect the coach to the generator output only if the generator is producing power. But if the generator is not producing A/C power, and there is A/C power coming in from the shore power cord, it will connect the coach to shore power only. Therefore, you will have access to only the one power source that you chose by whether or not the generator is running, but there is no way to share the load between the two sources.
It should not be necessary to unplug from shore power to run the generator because the transfer switch will disconnect you when the generator comes on line.
Gerald
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Mike,
Just a word of caution about switching back and forth between 30amp shore power and generator power. Please turn off your large amperage demand loads first. Air conditioning is the most common, electric heaters and anything that draws 1000 watts or more. Transfering these kind of "loads" thru the contacts of the transfer relay will eventually burn the contacts. This will cause a buzzing noise first and then a failure. Operating a 100amp coach on 30 amps will be a challenge at first but careful management will get you thru. Regards, Fred
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Michael,
For most of us it would not really be a wise approach to be augmenting your high power demand by switching over to the generator very often in a campground with other campers nearby. Noise, fumes, and at times possibly the need to run two airs may have you running the generator for longer periods of time. Many short runs of the generator are not so great for it either. If you can mange to live with 30 amps then that would be my decision maker to use that campsite for the long term. Just food for thought.
Later Ed
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I have found our Marquis to be less "30 amp friendly" than our previous 2000 PT. Some of the things that make the difference are the ice maker and Insta Hot. The Aqua Hot electric element draws more power than the electric heater with the Hurricane.
All of these can of course be shut off but you need to think about how much fuel you will use with 100% of HW and heating coming from the diesel burner. We just gave up our favorite site in Idaho Falls because we kept tripping the 30 amp breaker.
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I wasn't always this slow when it comes to understanding but I guess old age is setting in so please forgive the simplicity of my question. I am a full time camper and because of rising prices at my present campground, I am moving to another. The new site however only has 30amp service. I understand that this will have a major impact on my power use in particular with air & heat pump units maybe not running on 30 amp service. During periods of high load with air, TV, coffee maker going, can I just turn the generator on to pick up the extra load? Do I need to disconnect from shore power first?
Thanks for any help.
MJ
It's easy to forget that other rigs don't have Beaver quality sound insulation. If I were living full-time in an RV park I would want to be a good neighbor. No generator.
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We are presently boondocking in the Quechan Casino RV parking area. I carry a 3kw portable generator in the pickup and it's used when boondocking. It will kickout when the demand reaches about 2.7kw. Thus, I have learned to manage power usage in the coach when using either the portable generator or when plugged into 30 amp shore power. In these cases, 1) the instahot is unplugged, 2) the AquaHot electric water heater is switched off and diesel burner is switched on for showering and floor furnace heating, if necessary, 3) the rooftop air conditioners/heat pumps are not used, and 4) the new Xantrex Freedom inverter/charger is set to a lower Power Source (PS) rating, currently set to PS20A (20 amps). I found yesterday (by accident, mind you) there are several PS ratings on the new Xantrex - PS5A, PS10A, PS15A, PS20A, PS25A and PS30A. Setting the PS rating to 20 amps leaves 7 to 10 amps for other miscellaneous demand, e.g., TVs, lights, etc., that are not powered through the inverter.
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I wasn't always this slow when it comes to understanding but I guess old age is setting in so please forgive the simplicity of my question. I am a full time camper and because of rising prices at my present campground, I am moving to another. The new site however only has 30amp service. I understand that this will have a major impact on my power use in particular with air & heat pump units maybe not running on 30 amp service. During periods of high load with air, TV, coffee maker going, can I just turn the generator on to pick up the extra load? Do I need to disconnect from shore power first?
Thanks for any help.
MJ
It's easy to forget that other rigs don't have Beaver quality sound insulation. If I were living full-time in an RV park I would want to be a good neighbor. No generator.
Also check with the new park about gen set usage. Many do not allow genny use at all.
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I wasn't always this slow when it comes to understanding but I guess old age is setting in so please forgive the simplicity of my question. I am a full time camper and because of rising prices at my present campground, I am moving to another. The new site however only has 30amp service. I understand that this will have a major impact on my power use in particular with air & heat pump units maybe not running on 30 amp service. During periods of high load with air, TV, coffee maker going, can I just turn the generator on to pick up the extra load? Do I need to disconnect from shore power first?
Thanks for any help.
MJ
It's easy to forget that other rigs don't have Beaver quality sound insulation. If I were living full-time in an RV park I would want to be a good neighbor. No generator.
I always support BJ's views ( ;D, ) including this one. Genset noise and smell are acceptable only for dry camping.
Once in a delightful and favorite Idaho State park I ran into a Beaver owner. Other than the fact he refused to join the BAC, he was a nice guy. He showed be what he called "45 amp hookups". The idea is to use the primary cord plugged into the 30 amp outlet and run an additional cord from the 15 or 20 amp outlet in the same box. I've seen campers do this by running a cord through a window, but I didn't think is was very Beaver appropriate. So I installed a dedicated additional outlet on the back side of the shifter console. I ran the feed wire through and existing hole for a wire bundle and the male end of the cord rested in the electrical bay.
(I have yet to hear from the new owner asking why that outlet is dead all the time!!!)
For "45 Amp Hookups" I could use the new outlet for a baseboard heater along the wall. (Jerry Carr now has that heater!)
In less than hot weather we had the "two appliance" rule. First, I would set the charger to 10 amps. Once the batteries were fully charged, then any two things could be used, like coffee pot and hair dryer, or refer and hair dryer, or refer and washer/dryer. When we screwed up, the only thing that would happen is the breaker would pop. It was easier if we switched the refer to propane and left it alone. Running the refer on propane made it really easy.
In hot weather it would be one A/C and one appliance. If the refer is on propane and we made drip coffee with a filter cone it was still pretty easy.
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I've spoken with a couple of folks living in the RV park now. They recommended that anyone staying there get a generator because the power system is old and suffers from frequent power outages. I'll look into switching the aqua hot to diesel give electric. One more thing to learn. I unplugged the instahot the first week I had the coach. The TV, fridge & computer are my biggest & most frequent users. I ungraded the TV to a more modern LG model which should draw less than the Sony Plasma. I'm am going to be in the last site with a large open grassed are where my generator exhaust points so hopefully this will help. It's also right on the oven so that may also help with the wind blowing things around.
Thanks to you all for the suggestions & comments.
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In my search for things to help with my 30 amp campsite outlet I found this. Might be of use for others.
Camco Power Maximizer. Around $40 plus shipping from Amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-55025-PowerGrip-Maximizer-Adapter/dp/B0024E70L2
MJ
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Mike,
One caution with these devices. If your issue is kicking the power post breaker at 30 amps but the voltage is still 118 to 120V then this could help. If your issue is, as you draw current and approach 30 amps, you are also getting lower voltage like 110 to 112V or lower then the voltage drop in the campground wiring grid is inadequate to supply the voltage at the current you are trying to achieve. You can monitor the AC voltage on your coach panel as you add load to see what the issues are.
Later Ed
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Michael,
Another caution for the adapter that you listed. If either the 15 amp or 30 amp plug that you are plugging into with this adapter have a GFI, (almost all RV parks use a GFI on 15 amp plugs) it will not work because it is combining the neutral circuit between both plugs and therefore it will trip any GFI immediately.
Gerald
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In my search for things to help with my 30 amp campsite outlet I found this. Might be of use for others.
Camco Power Maximizer. Around $40 plus shipping from Amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-55025-PowerGrip-Maximizer-Adapter/dp/B0024E70L2
MJ
Mike, I made one of these to use. It works IF the 15 and 30 amp recepticles are on separate circuits ONLY. In an older park, this may not be the case. Henry
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In my search for things to help with my 30 amp campsite outlet I found this. Might be of use for others.
Camco Power Maximizer. Around $40 plus shipping from Amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-55025-PowerGrip-Maximizer-Adapter/dp/B0024E70L2
MJ
Mike, I made one of these to use. It works IF the 15 and 30 amp recepticles are on separate circuits ONLY. In an older park, this may not be the case. Henry
George, each has their own breaker so hopefully it will work.
MJ
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Mike,
One caution with these devices. If your issue is kicking the power post breaker at 30 amps but the voltage is still 118 to 120V then this could help. If your issue is, as you draw current and approach 30 amps, you are also getting lower voltage like 110 to 112V or lower then the voltage drop in the campground wiring grid is inadequate to supply the voltage at the current you are trying to achieve. You can monitor the AC voltage on your coach panel as you add load to see what the issues are.
Later Ed
I'm not tripping the breaker. I'm careful not to run too much at once. Only one big draw at a time. As for voltage, according to the AC In meter on the Trace display I'm only getting 107 - 108 volts. It's an old electrical system. The biggest problem is around dinner time, the convection & microwave will run but at a reduced cooking power.
MJ
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Michael,
With those low voltages within the campground grid you are at the mercy of everyone else's current usage in the park. That cord with the extra 20 amp plug connector really will be of little help given your situation. All you can do is manage your load like you have been as best that you can. You are at voltage levels that are not always kind to electronics so there may be times that you should consider manually disconnecting if need be. Anything below 105V would be my disconnect point.
Later Ed
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Michael,
Just my opinion, but sounds like you would be much better off getting out of that campground. With ac voltages running that low, you are risking a spike or voltage loss that could damage the electrical equipment in your coach. The cost of a new inverter, etc. can cover a lot of nights in an RV park with adequate electrical power.
Steve
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I've had some issues with the amp for the theatre system shutting off & on so I have started buying & using UPS battery backups to maintain an operational level for them. But that doesn't help the coach's builtin electronics. I'm looking for a new RV Park but given the price of this place is $350 month electric included I'll be hard pressed to find something remotely close. My armed forces pension only goes so far. I may end up selling the coach and finding an apartment. The place I just left was $930 a month which is an expensive price to park. I cancelled my order for the adapter as there's no sense buying something that isn't going to be useful.
MJ
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MJ,
Understand your dilemma. Using a UPS is a good strategy. I used one in my Marquis to prevent a surge that would turn off the TV every time the generator shut down. Sounds like you're making the best of the situation.The Marquis can be real power hogs so when on 30A be sure to reduce power needs as much as possible. I think those ideas have already been floated in this thread. Be sensitive to your lighting needs. E.G. The halogens are not at all efficient. In ours the dinette chandelier and the bath vanity lights would really throw off the heat. We replaced them with LEDs from HD / Lowes and no more heat.
Best of Luck,
Steve
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Thanks Steve. I've replaced all of my 12v lights with LED and don't use the 120 lights at all. With both sets of front ceiling LED lights on I swear you could get a sun tan.
MJ
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MJ,
Good! I did that same in my Marquis and the 07 Contessa.
Steve