BAC Forum
General Boards => Technical Support => Topic started by: William Harmon on September 09, 2016, 10:18:28 PM
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While in route to Fayetteville Arkansas, the air conditioner drive belt came off intact and with temps in upper 90's, wife not happy.. Book calls for a Dayco 17470. I purchased a Duralast 17470 from Autuzone but unable to stretch the belt onto the pulleys with the adjustment on the compressor all the way over. Also tried to replace original belt but could not stretch belt on. Wondering if there is way to put replacement belt on or am I missing something. Planning on going to Branson Missouri Sunday. All help appreciated.
William Harmon
2003 Contessa 3 slides
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I purchased a 17480 belt which is 1 inch longer and it tightened up with room to spare when moving the compressor so, I hope it stays on. Don't know why the old belt came off but will keep a close eye on the new belt.
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William,
It may be nothing more then a bad belt but it could also be a problem warning. Check that all items that the belt passes around, idlers etc move freely without any noise or binding.
If the compressor was beginning to have lube or wear issues and was binding heading to bearing failure it can cause the belt to throw as it heats up and binds. It may be nothing but pay attention to abnormal noise, clutch slippage leaving abnormal dust, or abnormal heating of the compressor or clutch. Poor cooling may be a telltale also. You save yourself some big headaches if you can get a compressor changed out before it actually fails freezing up and sending metal particles into the system. If you sense an issue with the compressor you can remove that belt and run with the roof airs and generator until you can have it changed out...Hope it is just a belt issue.
Later Ed
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William,
When I mentioned the possibility of running without a belt if needed, I was under the assumption that this was a single drive belt only running the compressor from what you had written. I am not sure of that, so whether that is appropriate or not is really based on your particular engine belt configuration.
Later Ed
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When I arrived in Branson, the compressor was making noise but still cooling. I have not tried to engage compressor after hearing a clicking noise that was not noticed from the drivers seat. The belt only drives the compressor coming direct from the flywheel. Wondering if coach could be driven with the belt in place and clutch not engaged or should it be removed before driving any further. Your input is appreciated.
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William,
The answer to your question will depend on where the noise is coming from. If the noise is coming from the compressor only when the clutch hub is turning, you can leave the belt on and just not turn on the A/C system. However, if the noise is coming from the pulley bearing that is located in the A/C belt pulley, you will need to remove the belt or the bearing will lock-up and burn the belt off.
Gerald
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Thanks Gerald & Ed, Just to be on the safe side, I will remove belt and have the unit checked when I return home. I guess thats all I can do at this point.
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If you decide to have your problem looked at in Branson, I highly recommend Branson Motor Coach on Shepard of the Hills Blvd.
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Just looking at the compressor clutch area,looks like the clutch plate is loose. The triangle plate that has 3 bolts passing through attached to the clutch plate. The 3 inserts around the bolts are missing. i think the loose clutch plate is making the clicking noise. Any ideas on whats going on??
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William,
A loose clutch plate like the one in your description is usually a result of a compressor failure. When a compressor has excessive resistance to turning or locks up completely, the excessive heat from the slipping clutch will cause the clutch damage that you described.
Gerald
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Thanks everybody, Looks like I will have to take coach in for repair when I get back home. With the help from the BAC forums, I have been able to do all my own maintentance up to this point and this has been a great asset to me. The weather is cooling down so the generator should keep us cool on our trip back home. Hope it doesn't cost an arm and leg to get the repair work done.
Later, William
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Any ideas as to where to take coach for A/C Compressor service?? I'm back in Oklahoma and need to get the air conditioner going before next trip as the heat continues to hang on. Thinking about taking it to a Truck Service facility that services the Cummings ISL engine.
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If you are able to put a vacuum on the system then you could actually do the work yourself. Upon purchase of our coach the compressor was no good and required replacing along with the expansion valve. I found the compressor on line by taking the number from off the side of the compressor. The expansion valve and filter dyer I got off of e bay doing a search for RV air conditioner expansion valve. If I remember correctly all was for less than $500 and then purchased the Freon. I believe it was about 4 lbs would have to look that back up. I would imagine to have someone do this work it would be somewhere around $2000 or more. I may have the purchase orders on line with some looking PM me if you want to go this route. I'm out of town on a work trip but have my computer with me.
Jim
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Thanks Jim for responding to another of my problems with the Contessa. It performed perfect on my trip to Branson with the exception of the A/C Compressor. I have a friend that may have the capability to pressurize the system and help me with the installation of a new compressor if that is what it needs. Let me check with him first before I start the project. I need to get caught up around the house for a few days. I'm in no great hurry to complete this. Let me get back with you.
Thanks again,
William
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I have decided to take on this project and have ordered a compressor model 458-46011(taken from the original build sheet). Wondering if I need a new dryer and expansion valve since the unit was producing cold air up till removing the belt from the compressor. The clutch pulley bearing seems tight and no play when turning the pulley. Jim, wondering if you have any numbers for the expansion valve or the dryer??
Thanks, william
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As a rule you should always replace the receiver/dryer when changing a compressor out.
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William,
Replacement of the dryer is optional, but it is usually a good idea when replacing a compressor. On the other hand, replacement of the expansion valve should not be needed if the system was cooling adequately before the compressor failure. Replacement of the compressor and dryer are relatively easy for the average handyman, but due to it's inaccessible location the expansion valve is more of a job.
Gerald
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The number on the valve comes up with a google search for "expansion valve ex6059". Still looking for order on filter.
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Drier number is Parker 085722-00.
Hope both these number help you out.
Jim
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Thanks Jim for the part numbers. I may not replace the expansion valve at this time. All other Parts are ordered and scheduled to arrive next week. Hope this works. I got 8.7 mpg for the 410 mile trip from Branson to Ardmore with the generator running all they way. William
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I am planning on having the AC System's freon R134A evacuated soon and I was wondering where the ports are to hook up the gauges?? Also, I am needing the torque settings for the compressor and dryer connections. Thanks in advance, William
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William,
Not sure of the ports but if you have a pull out generator they sometimes are above it and not convenient. Mine are on the compressor hose fittings but you would have seen those already if they were there. Some specs are here..
http://www.westlocktractor.com/tech/techlistd.php?ttID=25
Other sizes you can estimate from the table.
Later Ed
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Ours is a 2004 Marquis, but this tells where our dash a/c recharging port is.
http://beaveramb.org/forum/index.php/topic,5795.msg44621.html#msg44621
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Thanks Ed and David, I missed seeing the 2 ports near the compressor. I will try to use these to evacuate, vacuum and recharge the system. Learning as I go, Cheers William
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I think we found the cause of the compressor failure. When we installed the new compressor, we found the condenser fan locked up which was causing high head pressures when trying to introduce freon. Can anybody suggest where to get a replacement condenser fan for the 2003 Contessa? I think this will get the air conditioning up and running. Thanks, William
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William,
Just take the old motor for cross-reference purposes to any large auto parts supplier like Napa or Fleet Pride, and they should be able to furnish you with a new motor.
Gerald
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I just used the BAC Search window and found the replacement condenser fan available from JEGS for $67.97. Part on order,call off the dogs.
Thanks, William
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William,
Do you have a Jegs PN, I am dealing with what looks like a failed fan or pressure sensor. Hate to wait for a a shipment if I could find one locally. Put a new compressor on today along with a receiver dryer. Looks like fan is next much like your scenario...
Later Ed
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Hi Ed, The Jegs part number is 555-52133 (Universal Electric Fan 16" in Diameter) Price is $69.97 plus $9.99 handling which includes shipping. Information I got says it is an exact fit and bolts up in 30 min. Looks like 3 day delivery as mine is scheduled to arrive tomorrow. Good luck, William
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Thanks, always good to have the PN available. Still sorting out my air system fan issue, may be a bad ground connection, will get to the bottom of this tomorrow....
Later Ed
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Air conditioning job complete I think. Getting 44 deg. air out 0f dash vents. Thanks to all for your input. William
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William,
I had the same fail mode as you did, condenser fan not working, high head pressures eventually causing the compressor/clutch to fail. I replaced the compressor, receiver dryer, new Pag 45 oil. I found the fan issue after the new compressor and belt were installed. I went to investigate the condenser fan, pulled the wires and found 11.5V at the coach fan leads with AC on with no load, ignition on, and engine not running. I assumed the fan was bad and replaced it. I then found that the new fan had the same issue. Grrrr...
This is a heads up for anyone working on this system. If you see about 12V at the fan leads you may want to load test the wiring with a headlight before you go to the trouble of changing the fan out. I had 44 ohms in the wire that comes from the electrical bay to the fan, it should have been less than and ohm. I had to run a new wire and corrugated plastic shield from the electrical bay to the new fan and all is well. Coaches over the 10 -12 year mark may want to consider changing out the condenser fan preventatively. Fans are not that expensive, easy to change out in about an hour with just a few screws provided it is the same one. Much more costly and time consuming to deal with compressor failures. Hope this helps.
Later Ed
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Really good information, Ed I totally agree, the condenser fan is much easier and cheaper to change out than the compressor. I may set mine up on a 2 year change out. Glad you got your air conditioning system up and running.
William
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William,
I think more like a 10 year interval, but listen for it to make sure it sounds right and is working properly. My condenser fan comes on with the ignition and the AC button depressed before I crank the engine. If the interior fan is on low and I slide the small widow open I can hear it before I crank, that may be a good check to do at start up.
Later Ed
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Ed,
The condenser fan on some does not come on with the A/C compressor clutch like yours apparently does. A lot of coaches only power the condenser fan when the high pressure side has enough pressure to close a switch. So on those coaches, the condenser fan only runs when the compressor is running and has a sufficient head pressure.
Gerald
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Ed,
The condenser fan on some does not come on with the A/C compressor clutch like yours apparently does. A lot of coaches only power the condenser fan when the high pressure side has enough pressure to close a switch. So on those coaches, the condenser fan only runs when the compressor is running and has a sufficient head pressure.
Gerald
Thats the way my 2001 Contessa is Gerald and Ed. The condenser fan does not come on until the head pressure builds. When CAT replaced all my a/c parts they found that the condenser fan wasn't coming on but sporadically. So they replaced the fan. They did get mine cooling but it didn't last long. I still must have a leak somewhere else that was missed. So its back to generator and roof air again for now. Works better that way anyhow, so its no big deal for me.
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Gerald, Lamonte,
Head pressure sensing with a trinary switch was how my older Contessa worked and so it would cycle like yours. Thanks for pointing that out. The 2002 Marquis system I think is simpler, if the dash air is powered on, the fan is on. I kind of like that approach, not relying on a pressure sensor......of course neither system works if the wiring isn't good :-)
Later Ed