Thanks guys, I keep hearing about these tone generators, sounds like it's time I invested in one, for now I have been muddling my way through just by trying every cable for signal , managed to trace a couple of runs, but for the life of me can't find the feed from outside, unless it does not terminate in the compartment above the driver, I had to bypass it with a new cable run through the window. Possibly a problem with the cord reel outside.