No power to the instrument panel or ignition

[Tom Chace]

Morning everyone,

I have a series of issues with my coach.

1. The Main would not start - I had the converter shut off during an unrelated job for a few weeks
2. I went chasing possible problems - didn't find it but managed to make the problem worse
3. I swapped the solenoid in the electric bay with a different one but didn't look closely enough
  a. The original solenoid is insulated
   b. The replacement was grounded
    I think this was my second - Big mistake
4. My problem now is no power to the ignition OR drivers instrument panel at/through the ignition switch, no power.
5. I found that I popped the #5 fuse in the battery compartment so I replaced that
6. I tried to find the fuse to the instrument panel in the electric bay(top left of the fuses) and replaced that but no change - still no power to the instrument panel

My thoughts now are to FIX THE PRIMARY PROBLEM then replace the solenoid in the electric bay, replace the solenoid above the batteries--- this will not get me to the final solution because I have to find where the power is interrupted and by what fuse/module/relay. Once I have that I will address the starter.

I have myself in a situation that I need help with so I am asking for any help that is available from the group.

What do you think???

Tom Chace

1999 Beaver Monterey
3126b CAT

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

Tom,
Do you have power to the ignition buss bar in the electrical bay when the key is on? In other words, is the ignition solenoid working.
Steve

[Dave Atherton]

Tom, to get you started you need power to the ECM on connection J-1 wiring harness connector
going into the Engine ECM which is the connection to the rear on the ECM. What you are looking
For at this J-1 connector wiring harness red wire in lower left corner on connector or taking the
Connector loose with Allen wrench and removing connector for wiring harness same location
Lower left corner ( you are looking for Pin 70 which is the 12 Power for the ECM and ground
pins in middle on ECM connection next row up from bottom pin 53, 54, 56 ) not sure on one ground
pin but will look up when I return home. This will power up your ECM and should get you going.
Working away from the ECM knowing what wires will get you going you should look at broken power
Wire or fuse ground on relay. Dave Atherton Retired Cat Mechanic

[Tom Chace]

Steve,

No power

I fried my meter doing another test so I am on my way to getting a new one

Tom

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

Tom,
Check to see if you have battery power on the input post of the solenoid (also should have it on the battery buss in electrical bay). If no power there, you probably have a blown fuse in the battery bay (one of the large high amperage ones). If you do have power on the input you probably have a bad solenoid. To be sure, turn the  key on and see if you have 12V on one of the small solenoid terminals,. If so, bad solenoid.
Steve

[Tom Chace]

OK

Back from taking a break and playing in the ocean.

I will pick up the project on Tuesday as we are going to get nasty weather.

I plan on taking all steps outlined to try to get a response from the coach.

Thanks to all

Tom

[Tom Chace]

 Hi All,

From my first message

I went chasing possible problems - didn't find it but managed to make the problem worse
3. I swapped the solenoid in the electric bay with a different one but didn't look closely enough
  a. The original solenoid is insulated
   b. The replacement was grounded

Would this mistake make me look for a popped fuse in the electric bay?
I tried the IG PWR top left but nothing changed

Tom

PS am following up on everyone's advice

[Tom Chace]

Update

The solenoid that I used to replace the starter solenoid was the same as what was originally in the coach - Insulated Cole Hersee 24117-BX

Now that the solenoid is shown to be correct I can chase down the original problem of not starting

After replacing the starter solenoid I tried to start the coach and popped the #5 fuse in the battery box

I am going to check the ECM on the Main as suggested and work back from there

Thanks to All

I will update as soon as possible

Tom

[Tom Chace]

Steve,

There are 2 solenoids in play here if I am reading correctly - One in the electric bay (Insulated) the other in the battery compartment which looks to be original and in need of replacement.

Bought a new meter - Problem 1 solved
I had the diode backwards - Problem 2 solved

Meter read 13+V in batteries, power on the input of the solenoid in the elect bay and power at the ignition switch.
With the meter in front of me - I turned the key to on and my voltage went away and no other power at the ignition switch.

I then put the meter on the solenoid in the elect bay - at the off position of the key --- I have power to the input then turning the key to on I have power to the input side but not to the exit side or to either of the small poles

I then switched out the solenoid to the Cole Hersee 42117 there was no change.

What I have at this point is

When I turn on the Ignition switch - no power and no start
Not sure if the solenoid (elect bay) is working or not

Could there be a fuse blown that controls the instrument panel? The top left 15 amp fuse labeled as IG Switch has power on both poles so is good.

Thank You

Tom

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

Tom,
I don't think it is a fuse as you have power with key off. It sounds like you may have a shorted diode at the solenoid in the front electrical bay. Make sure the diode between the 2 small terminals on the solenoid is connected correctly. The band should be to your left (toward the battery buss) as you look at it. Also be sure it is not shorted. Remove one side of it and measure the resistance across it. Then reverse the meter leads and read it again. There should be a significant difference in resistance between the 2 readings. If not, replace the diode.
Battery power is supplied to the small terminals of the solenoid from from CB1 on the battery buss. From there it goes through the ignition switch to the solenoid terminal. If the diode is bad, CB1 may be tripping. It will reset when the load is off.
Steve

[Tom Chace]

Thank You Steve,

That is one issue resolved
I removed the diode and the power came back to the inst panel
I am about to be the proud owner of 50 diodes - soooo if anyone is in need of a diode or two send them my way.

Now -- with that issue gone

The coach is back to not starting - but I have power to the inst panel

Is the solenoid in the battery compartment also a starter solenoid???

Tom

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

Tom,
The solenoid in the battery compartment is probably the "coach power or "salesman switch" It removes 12v from the coach when the coach power switch (normally near the entry door) is pressed. It reapplies power when the switch is pressed again.
When you say the coach doens't start, please describe more fully. Is the engine turning over? If not do you hear a click from the starter?, etc.
Thx, Steve

[Tom Chace]

Thanks Steve,

When trying to start

Turn the key to start position and nothing.
No clicks nothing
There doesn't seem to be any power (12V) going to the starter at all.

I did change out the rear (battery box) solenoid - that is a tough one to get to!

Tom

[Tom Chace]

Steve

You wrote:
(If you do have power on the input you probably have a bad solenoid. To be sure, turn the  key on and see if you have 12V on one of the small solenoid terminals,. If so, bad solenoid.)


I do have 12 V on one of the small terminals as well as the other large pole of the solenoid when the key is in the on position - Is that what you were talking about?

Tom

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

Tom,
With key on, you should have 12v on both large terminals and the small terminal nearest the battery buss (one closest to the band on the diode).
Steve