Author Topic: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat  (Read 9699 times)

D. Wendal Attig

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2018, 02:54:55 PM »
Fred Cook,
Is that the rocker switch with the squiggly line in a rectangle and a "short tail" graphic?
Thanks,

D. Wendal

David T. Richelderfer

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2018, 04:31:03 PM »
Block heaters come in several different forms.  Some heat oil, some heat coolant, some heat and circulate coolant, some are simply blankets that are thrown over the engine like an electric blanket on a bed.  Our coach does not have a block heater that I know of, but we do have an AquaHot with the Engine PreHeat function.  We use it in temperatures under 40F.  The couple of times I remember, the AquaHot Engine Preheat took the Aladdin reported engine temperature from cold up to 80F/90F in an hour or so.
2004 Beaver Marquis Sapphire

I had a dream... then I lived it!

Steve Huber Co-Admin

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2018, 06:08:34 PM »
Most CAT engines will de-rate power until coolant temp is about 82F so that is probably the minimum temp one should target during pre-heat.
Steve
Steve
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2015- 6/24  07 Contessa Bayshore C9,  400 hp
2013-2015: 00 Marquis Tourmaline, C12, 425 hp
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Fred Cook

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2018, 07:28:51 PM »
Fred Cook,
Is that the rocker switch with the squiggly line in a rectangle and a "short tail" graphic?
Thanks,

D. Wendal

Yep, that’s it. I don’t use it unless I am going to drive the coach the next day or if the temp gets below 10 degrees. I do use the aqua hot to keep the coach from freezing when it gets below 32 and I set it on 50. Fred
Fred & Cindy
2002 Beaver Patriot Thunder 455, C12 CAT
Towing 2019 Chevy Equinox, AWD Diesel
South Central Missouri, US Army Retired

Gerald Farris

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #19 on: January 04, 2018, 02:31:42 AM »
All coaches did not come with a block heater. I have owned 3 Beaver coaches, and only the 1993 Patriot with propane heat and a 8.3 liter Cummins had a block heater. The other 2 coaches have Cat C 12 engines, and they used the hydronic heating system to preheat the engine. Since this is an optional feature on some coaches, there may be a few coaches out there without a preheat source, but I have never seen one.

Gerald

Samuel Sperbeck

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2018, 07:53:28 PM »
Our 2001 Patriot Thunder doesn't have a block heater or engine preheat on the HydroHot. I looked on the rear of the HydroHot and there is no circulating pump there, however the engine preheat fittings have hoses on them so I'm guessing the engine will heat the HydroHot while driving, and provide interior heat.
The rocker switch on the panel to the left of the drivers seat with the squiggly line in a rectangle with a tail is for the mirror heaters on our coach. It is directly behind the mirror adjustment knob.
I suspect I could add a block heater to the Cat C12 engine but in the short time we have had the coach we have not had a need for a block heater. The last time we used the coach at the end of October in 33 degree temperature the engine started easily.

Fred Cook

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2018, 09:01:13 PM »
Our 2001 Patriot Thunder doesn't have a block heater or engine preheat on the HydroHot. I looked on the rear of the HydroHot and there is no circulating pump there, however the engine preheat fittings have hoses on them so I'm guessing the engine will heat the HydroHot while driving, and provide interior heat.
The rocker switch on the panel to the left of the drivers seat with the squiggly line in a rectangle with a tail is for the mirror heaters on our coach. It is directly behind the mirror adjustment knob.
I suspect I could add a block heater to the Cat C12 engine but in the short time we have had the coach we have not had a need for a block heater. The last time we used the coach at the end of October in 33 degree temperature the engine started easily.

OK... I apologize for saying earlier that the squiggly line button was the engine pre-heat.  When buying the coach i could not imagine a unit this nice and the price for it would not have an engine preheat so I thought that button was it. The seller did not point that out to me either and that squiggly line on the button seems to indicate liquid such as coolant or oil. So.... i feel like an idiot thinking it was heating my motor in sub zero weather over the past several days.  Had i known it did not have a preheat I would have passed on buying it.  Now I have a coach that will be difficult to start or maybe won't start in extreme cold temps. Bummer!
Fred & Cindy
2002 Beaver Patriot Thunder 455, C12 CAT
Towing 2019 Chevy Equinox, AWD Diesel
South Central Missouri, US Army Retired

Katie Peterson

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #22 on: February 08, 2018, 07:58:56 PM »
I hate to admit that in five years I have not figured this out completely.  The engine heats the hot water and the aquqhot through the aquahot circulation system? Right? The switch next to the drivers seat right behind the mirror adjustment knob turns on the circulation I think?

I need some Beaver Club advice!

Tim Peterson
2000 Beaver Patriot
Tim & Katie Peterson

David T. Richelderfer

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #23 on: February 08, 2018, 08:53:01 PM »
We obviously have a different year and model of coach.  But here is how I think ours works and the location of the switches on our coach.

Yes, when running the engine's coolant is pumped forward to heat the water (for sinks and shower use) at the Aquahot and offers heat at the dash for interior heating and windshield defrosting/defogging.

When the engine is not running, then the Aquahot will heat water (for sinks and shower use) by both the electric element or the diesel burner.  Both the electric element and diesel burner can be ON concurrently, but the electric element only works using either the onboard generator or shore power.  The diesel burner and engine pre-heat will work from battery power without the generator or shore power.

The electric element switch is located in the 110v panel in the bedroom and is labeled "Hydronic Heater."  The "Diesel Burner" and "Engine Pre-Heat" switches (separate switches) are located on the exterior of the forward wall of the kitchen cabinets over the sink.  If the "Diesel Burner" is ON, then its associated green light is ON.  The "Engine Pre-Heat" switch does not have an associated green light.

To pre-heat the engine before starting on cold days, turn on both the diesel burner and engine pre-heat.  After a time, say 30 to 60 minutes, the engine will be warmed up to 80-100 degrees according to the engine temperature found on the Aladdin/Silverleaf.  If running the onboard generator or plugged into shore power, then one could use both the electric element AND the diesel burner to more quickly pre-heat the engine.

The onboard generator can be started/stopped at the generator switch, at the dash switch or at the bedroom switch (3 separate switches at three separate locations).
« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 08:58:06 PM by David T. Richelderfer »
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Steve Huber Co-Admin

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #24 on: February 08, 2018, 09:48:07 PM »
Tim,
If I remember correctly the switch you are referring to is labeled Coach Heat and will provide circulation so the engine provides the heat needed for the normal Aqua Hot functions; hot water and heat for the coach if required.
Steve
Steve
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2015- 6/24  07 Contessa Bayshore C9,  400 hp
2013-2015: 00 Marquis Tourmaline, C12, 425 hp
2005-2013: 01 Contessa Naples, 3126B, 330 hp

Joel Ashley

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #25 on: February 08, 2018, 09:59:18 PM »
Tim, as David notes, the engine has an extra line that routes it’s coolant through the hydronic unit.  When the engine is warm that coolant’s heat acts like a 3rd source (besides the diesel and the 110v electric), moved by the engine’s water pump.  It is exchanged inside the hydronic unit to the floor heat glycol tubes that run to and from your heat registers, and to your hot water, and then the resulting cooler coolant loops back to the engine.  It isn’t intended as a stand-alone source though, but rather as an augmentor, so for complete house heat or hot water your hydronic unit must be on.  As long as the engine is running you may as well use that heat energy to reduce the use of diesel by the hydronic burner.

I’ve not heard of one of our coaches not having that feature unless perhaps they don’t have hydronic.  But I understand that some rigs may not have the reverse, an engine preheat pump as part of their hydronic unit.  If you do, there will be somewhere inside the living area an Engine Preheat switch that activates a separate pump to move the hydronic-warmed engine coolant back through the loop to the engine.  On particularly cold mornings that is handy for getting the engine temp closer to 100 degrees prior to breaking camp.  Once the engine is started you can turn off the Engine Preheat switch/circulating pump.

Now don’t confuse that switch with another commonly found by the driver’s seat that may labeled “Block Heater”.  The Block Heater is an entirely different animal used in freezing climates, and involves a 110v heating circuit to warm the engine oil well in advance of anticipated engine startup.  Warmer, less viscous oil is easier for the engine to move at startup.  You must plug it into an extension cord from a 20 amp park post or other source.  The dash switch merely activates the outlet in the engine compartment that the plug is wired into... at least that’s my take on it since I’ve never had to use it on our coach.  Most people don’t as few use their coach in subzero weather deep enough that the hydronic Engine Preheat feature isn’t adequate alone.

Unless you live in Alaska or Canada year-round or have an unusual circumstance requiring the block oil to be heated, you can probably ignore that switch.  You should look for an Engine Preheat one however.  Ours is handy on the same galley switch plate as the diesel and electric Hydrohot switches, but I know on other coaches the Preheat switch can be mounted elsewhere, or you may not have that feature at all, as I alluded to in paragraph two - it may have been an option and not included.  Someone else here with a 2000 Patriot may provide input to help you locate it if it exists.

Joel

Addendum:  I see by the 2000 Patriot brochure that a Hurricane hydronic system is standard, not Aguahot.  I see no available Preheat upgrade listed, so unless a previous owner changed to an Aquahot along the way, one with a Preheat pump, it may very well be you won’t find a Preheat switch.

That said, our engines will start at nominal temps sans preheating, but it may take longer letting them warm up before pulling out, to better-handle highway rpm’s.

« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 10:35:00 PM by Joel Ashley »
Joel and Lee Rae Ashley
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LaMonte Monnell

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #26 on: February 09, 2018, 02:21:28 AM »
My wife gets cold when it drops below 70 so I have no worries of ever being anywhere too cold to manage to get the CAT awakened for travel!

I guess I could always open the hatch and add a dryer vent duct to a portable heater for a while. If that would even help at all. I have no idea if it would or not.

She has already nixed my Alaska idea even in the summertime!
Lamonte & Patti Monnell
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CAT 3126B
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Weeki Wachee,Fl

Gerald Farris

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #27 on: February 09, 2018, 06:34:48 AM »
Tim,
Like Steve said, the switch that you are referring to should be marked "Coach Heat", and is so, it only turns on the circulation pump for your Hurricane heating system so you can turn on the heating system to heat the coach when driving without turning on the Hurricane. It does not preheat the engine. If your coach has a preheat option, there will be another switch labeled "Preheat". If you have that switch, it turns on another pump to circulate the engine coolant through the Hurricane system so the Hurricane will preheat the engine if the Hurricane is running.

Gerald   
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Fred Cook

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #28 on: February 09, 2018, 12:03:06 PM »
Just left Memphis  yesterday morning. I do not have any preheat capability at all. I was happy that the motor started right up at 26°.
Fred & Cindy
2002 Beaver Patriot Thunder 455, C12 CAT
Towing 2019 Chevy Equinox, AWD Diesel
South Central Missouri, US Army Retired

LaMonte Monnell

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Re: Block Heater vs Aqua Hot Engine Preheat
« Reply #29 on: February 09, 2018, 01:53:04 PM »
Just left Memphis  yesterday morning. I do not have any preheat capability at all. I was happy that the motor started right up at 26°.
Thats a great thing to hear the engine purring....
Lamonte & Patti Monnell
2001 Beaver Contessa Naples DP 40' 2 slides
CAT 3126B
2021 Chevrolet Silverado Trail Boss

Weeki Wachee,Fl