Under Cabinet Lighting

[Paul Meehan]

Bought replacement LED puck lights from Doug Allman.  First one went in and is working nicely.  Today attempted to install a second light.  Dropped existing halogen light above front passenger seat and found very little wire to connect onto.  So moved on to the next light.  More wire to work with.  Cut off old fixture put VOM on wires turned on switch reading of 12V.  The first fixture with short wires lit up as well.  Turned switch off.  Connected new fixture (white to white and black to black) and turned on switch.  New fixture and first old fixture as well as all under cabinet lights in bathroom, kitchen and living room did not work nor the patio/stairwell lights.  Pulled and Checked 12V fuses in bedroom closet with VOM and all checked out.  Replaced the fuse labeled patio light.  Still no power.
BAC must be very busy today.  Left messages at various intervals.  No return call after 5 hours.
Any suggestions on where else to look for a fuse or any other potential solution would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance!

[Steve Huber]

Paul,
Try disconnecting the last LED you wired and see if that remedies the problem. You cannot go by wire color for the puck lights. Halogens are not polarity sensitive so Beaver/Monaco installers just wired them randomly. For LEDs, 12v must be run to the positive and gnd to the negative wire. I wired mine by using a VOM to ID the voltage polarity of the supply at the LED before installing. Turn power off to install, then back on the check. Do one light at time. You will probably find some supply lines have white as power and others with black as power.
I have these lights and other LEDs in all positions in our coach. They work great.
Steve

[Paul Meehan]

Will do, thanks

[David T. Richelderfer]

I replaced all 57 halogen lights several years back with LED lights.  When I connected the wires, I first checked to make sure each light worked... BEFORE inserting each LED fixture up into its final position.  The LED lights are polarity sensitive.  If you attach the wires incorrectly, then the LED light will not function.

As mentioned in an earlier post, I would suggest you pull out the LED lights that don't work and switch the wires.

[Paul Meehan]

Steve, as a FYI the black wire on the new fixtures is the hot wire.  All older halogen fixtures worked yesterday.
1. Dropped first halogen light over passenger seat and found wires too short for my large fingers to convert to LED, so I left it hanging for the time being.
2. Dropped next light to the right of the first light. 
3. Removed halogen light, stripped wire and found I had 12+ at that location.
4. If I remember correctly with the VOM connected to the exposed wires black to black and red to white and the light over passenger seat was lit.
5. Connected LED light to wires black to black white to white.  Turned switch on and got no light.
6.  From that point on I have no power to this circuit which includes under cabinet lights in living room, bathroom, kitchen as well as patio light/stairwell lights.
7. Checked 12V fuses in bedroom closet and all showed continuity.
8. I did replace the 15 amp fuse for the patio light just to play it safe.
9. Still no power in this one circuit, so unable to determine which existing wire is hot and which is the ground.
10.  Does anyone know if switch could go bad or if there are any other fuses in the circuit?
Any additional suggestions are appreciated.

[Mike Shumack]

S
4. If I remember correctly with the VOM connected to the exposed wires black to black and red to white and the light over passenger seat was lit.
5. Connected LED light to wires black to black white to white.  Turned switch on and got no light.
6.  From that point on I have no power to this circuit which includes under cabinet lights in living room, bathroom, kitchen as well as patio light/stairwell lights.
7. Checked 12V fuses in bedroom closet and all showed continuity.

Paul, Steve already said this - but I'll say again anyways - some of the LED lights are polarity sensitive, meaning if you don't put positive and negative to the correct LED wire leads (never mind the wire color), it wont light up. So if your voltmeter shows 12V when connected to the wire leads in the ceiling and if the LED doesn't light, swap the wires to the LED.
In step 6 are you testing for power with the Voltmeter, or assuming you have no power because the new LED doesn't light up?

[Scott Ramsey]

Sounds like a worthwhile project.  Can someone give me contact information for the source of your replacement LED's?  I searched the site and couldn't come up with anything.  Probably because I don't know what I am doing
Thanks,
Scott

[Mike Shumack]

Scott, I bought a bunch of LED lighting from these guys https://www.ledsupply.com/

Not the ceiling lights - that was already done by PO, but I've added light strips at the entry steps and just bought another set for the indirect ceiling lighting.
Their prices are good and they are very fast to respond to (e-mailed) questions. So far everything I bought from them has been a very good quality.

On the ceiling lights, I did have a couple that started to flicker. So I got some replacements on Amazon (cheap ones, like $2 each) but they didn't work too good either. Supposedly the cheap ones have poor voltage regulators. Then I bought some really expensive ones at M4 http://www.m4products.com/ as this place is highly recommended on the irv2 forum (they work fine and no flicker, but I'd go broke if I tried to do the entire coach with those ($11 each). If I ever need any more ceiling LEDs I will try the LED Supply site brands.

[Paul Meehan]

Mike, I tested for power with both the VOM and LED light.  No sign of power.  I understand what you and Steve are saying.  However, with no power to the circuit I cannot determine which wire is hot.
This is new to me so I apologize in advance.

[Mike Shumack]

Understood Paul.
Don't apologize - this is all new to me too.
I just happen to have some background in mechanics, but most of what I post here I learned from someone else on the forum, and I'm just repeating/sharing.

Have you looked at any of the wiring diagrams? I didn't see one specific for your floorplan, but there are several on Patriot such as this one http://beaveramb.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Patriot-40ft-Gettysberg-DC-Distribution.pdf
It shows the overheads in groups (like sofa, galley, etc.) with a switch for each group. Assuming your setup is similar, I would first see if any of the other ceiling light groups come on. If they do, that means the main power supply and fuse is good. Then you go the switch and see if you have power to it.

Also, I did not realize this until I looked a the drawing, but all of the lights are wired in "Series" so if any one light in the group has an open (is removed) none of the lights in the group will work (like the old Xmas tree lights). I know this is not the case in my 2005 Patriot (so this could be a mistake in the drawing) but if not, that's something to consider when troubleshooting. it's just the way the electrical diagram is drawn - they don't show a separate power and ground for each light. My coach's diagram is the same, so it's just the drawing, the lights are wired in parallel.

Sorry if you already did this - I need to go back and review the posts to see what was checked.

[Steve Huber]

Scott,
Contact Roy Boles. He has the replacement units. Post is in For Sale baord.
http://beaveramb.org/forum/index.php/topic,7648.0.html
Steve

[Steve Huber]

Paul,
I see 2 possiblities; either the "salesman switch" on the front dash is off, which would kill all 12v power to the coach interior, or, more likely, a circuit breaker is tripped. The 2000 wiring diagrams show a CB4 (15A) powering the lights you are having trouble with. The 12V breaker panel should be located in the rear closet.
Steve

[Paul Meehan]

Will check it out.  Thanks!

Steve, is that 2000 wiring diagram posted with the “Coach Assist” documents?

[Steve Huber]

Paul,
In Coach Assist, it is shown in the 2003 Marquis wiring diagrams (same as 2000). Look in section 5 on the 2nd page of the 12V layout diagrams.
Steve