Engine Oil and Transmission Fluid Analysis

[Bill Sprague]

At the beginning of the Maintenance Round-table at the Kerrville rally a couple weeks ago there was discussion of oil analysis.

Since then, I have run samples of both my engine oil and transmission fluid through the lab.  It is the second time I've done it.   When I started, my primary motivation was the idea that I might be able to spot any coolant in the transmission fluid before it did any damage.  At the time, Tim Bentley was have a transmission replaced.  

Attached are .jpg copies of the .pdf file that was emailed to me.   Clicking on them seems to make them easy enough to read.  The original is much better  and I can email it to you if your interested.  Blackstone provides a guide for reading their reports here:  http://www.blackstone-labs.com/report-explanation.php

Essentially, the engine oil report confirms it is time to change my oil and the transmission report suggests it is not necessary to replace the Transynd.  

[Dan Murphy]

Thanks for sharing Bill. I Would bet your day was a little brighter after reviewing these reports!

Dan

[Keith Moffett]

Bill
Looks like you do this annualy?  I would like to know how the samples are taken and the quantity used.  Also what kind of container is used like a test tube or whatever and where that is available?

Seperately I have been considering changing to Transend but I did so on the old coach and it shifted very hard afterward.  Do you have an opinion on any of this?


Thanks
Keith

[Joel Weiss]

Many of you use Blackstone for your analyses.  I have had just as good results using http://www.jglubricantservices.com/ at a lower cost.  I have no stake in this, I just want people to know that there are qualified alternatives to Blackstone.

[Bill Sprague]

Bill
Looks like you do this annualy?  I would like to know how the samples are taken and the quantity used.  Also what kind of container is used like a test tube or whatever and where that is available?

Seperately I have been considering changing to Transend but I did so on the old coach and it shifted very hard afterward.  Do you have an opinion on any of this?


Thanks
Keith

Keith,

I've only started doing it and my first two samples are about a year apart.  I might do it twice a year to keep an eye on the transmission.  It may be groundless, but I developed a fear of transmission repair or replacement caused by radiator failures.  

Blackstone mails you the test kits for free.  The small bottles are about three ounces.  Blackstone sells a suction pump for about $30 that can be used to extract fluid.  The small bottle screws to the pump and about 6 feet of ordinary 1/4 inch plastic tubing threads through the pump into the bottle.  You put the tubing down the dip stick hole, pump a few times and the bottle fills.  It is very easy and very clean.  

The sample kit includes legal USPS packaging for the liquid sample container and an addressed outer container.   If you need it, Blackstone will provide a copy of a letter from the USPS for you to show the local post office that it is OK to ship the liquid.

You send a check or credit card number with the sample for $25.   In about a week you get the results by email.  

I don't know how you tell if one lab is better, or of a better value, than another.  Transmissions can cost $10,000 or more to repair.  For me, the $25 per sample seems OK.  

I have no answer about Transynd and shifting as our came with it.  I have nothing to compare to.  If I remember right, you bought a newer motorhome not long ago.  I would be surprised if it didn't also come with Transynd.

I'll show you the kit when we go clamming.  I have two spare (free) sample kits.  We can take samples of yours if you want.  

[Bill Sprague]

Many of you use Blackstone for your analyses.  I have had just as good results using http://www.jglubricantservices.com/ at a lower cost.  I have no stake in this, I just want people to know that there are qualified alternatives to Blackstone.

Joel,

I looked up JG Lubricant Services.  They have a $21 kit, a $27 kit and a $40 kit.  I don't know how to compare them to the $25 price from Blackstone.  

Somebody told me that Speedco will do them and I've read where Allison service dealers will do them too.  

I have absolutely no idea how to figure out if one is better than another.

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

Keith,
re Shifting; we changed to Transynd with our 01 Contessa (Allison 3000 series) and the effect (smoother, more positive shifting/no searching) was very noticeable. We put Transynd in the Marquis (Allison 4000 series) but saw no noticeable difference. PO's records didn't specify fluid type at previous change but cost indicates it was Dextron. Marquis shifted smoothly pre and post change-over.
Steve

[Keith Moffett]

We recieved no maintenance log from the PO when we bought the new coach last year.  Now I think about it it could have been changed to Transynd already.  We are slowly doing all the maintenance from scratch just so we know where we stand.
Thanks Bill and Steve.

[Gerald Farris]

Keith,
If you are not sure about your transmission fluid, I would definitely have a fluid analysis run. It is a lot cheaper than changing the transmission fluid, and then you will know more about the fluid than you would if you had records.

Gerald  

[Matthew Harger]

So as a new owner to an old Beaver, after getting our coach last August, I had just about all the major fluids and filters replaced in February 2014.  I did not have an exact maintenance record to go by from the previous owner(s) so thought it safest to just do it all.  

We typically use our coach for short weekend trips usually once a month and by the time February rolls around again I will suspect we will have put maybe 2500-3000 miles on it at most since all the fluids were done.

My questions is now with the ability to have these fluids tested by these labs, should I stick to the once a year oil change regardless of miles or rather send a sample and see if the oil is still of usable quality before having it  changed out?    Same question with the new Transynd that was put in,  but obviously that would not be a yearly change out anyways but maybe worth a yearly test.

[Gerald Farris]

Matt,
If you listen to Caterpillar, they will tell you to change the engine yearly, regardless of the low mileage. However, my opinion is that if an oil analysis comes back with good reading on the oil condition, I would not change it with such low usage.

Gerald

[Steve Huber Co-Admin]

CAT advised me to change oil based on fuel consumed. For the 3126B they recommended changing oil after burning 1100 gal of fuel. That worked out to about 7700 miles.
Steve

[Matthew Harger]

Thanks Gerald and Steve.  I think you likely just saved me a few hundred bucks.   I think i'll do the lab analysis on both the oil and tranny just to have a baseline,  especially for the tranny  that might go several years without need for a change.   If I can do the engine oil every other year based on our limited use at the moment that'd be great.

[Edward Buker]

I have been doing every other year. I change it and we do 3K miles the first summer, the second summer it is 6K miles and then we change it as soon as we get home. That is a few more miles then I like between changes but it is mostly all interstate with little idle time. Just can't bring myself to change the oil at 3K miles without a real need. We have been doing this the last 4 years and we use no oil between changes of shell rottella 15w40. We have the synthetic blend in it now. I always use a Cat High efficiency oil filter which is a different PN then the original one in the manual.

Later Ed

[Bill Sprague]

I have been doing every other year. I change it and we do 3K miles the first summer, the second summer it is 6K miles....

I've started to apply the same logic to my Hydro-Hot.  I run it frequently enough that the fuel doesn't turn to jelly or what ever it does with lack of use.  If the exhaust stays clear, I extend the annual service interval to something convenient.   Replacing a clean and underused filter and nozzle with ones only a little less used does not make sense.  

So far, none of my Hydro Hot failures had anything to do with nozzles, filters, adjustments or inspectable items.