Wife threatens to leave if I can't get water working!

[D. Wendal Attig]

We seem to have a water problem in our Beaver Patriot Monticello. Sometimes we have it. Sometimes we don't. We are currently boondocking and relying entirely on the internal systems to deliver what we need.

Sunday we serviced the freshwater using an external pressure control at the hose. When the internal coach monitor panel indicated the tank was full we turned off the fill valve, started the pump and water operated correctly from every faucet spray nozzle Etc inside the coach.

Later that day we were able to take hot showers had both hot and cold water at sufficient pressure levels throughout the coach. By the next day the water pressure diminished then entirely sputtered as if no Prime could be generated by the pump which was nevertheless still running.

After reviewing several posts on the Forum, I was not sure what to do.

Assuming that we still have an indication of 66 gallons or 64% fresh tank level and are parked in a generally flat area, I assumed perhaps the pump was not able to maintain a prime. So I replaced the pump with a new model  cleaning the filter (which was not dirty) and activating the new pump, purging the air systematically, which produced the same results. Sputter...sputter.

I need to get this fixed as quickly as possible. Your advice and help is appreciated.

[Mike Groves]

I think someone mistakenly turned on the fill valve when they thought they were turning on the pump.  I just say that because its happened to me, and that the effects are the same as you've described.

Mike

[D. Wendal Attig]

The fill valve was turned on in order to divert the water into the fresh water tank. After that the valve was turned off (assuming the cmp showing  full fresh water was accurate) Then the pump was turned on, air purged and faucets worked. Nothing was changed from that point forward except using the faucets and shower.

CMP still indicates we have water. Pump runs. Gurgle only at the  faucets now. Did we get the sequence wrong?   What changed in the system?

[Gerald Farris]

D,
I would make absolutely certain that the fresh water tank is full or close to it before continuing with your repairs. You monitoring panel may be wrong and you could have an empty fresh water tank. Also, like Mike said, double check the fill valve.

Gerald

[D. Wendal Attig]

I'll give that a try. I have seen several references in this forum for allowing the fill to overflow until they see it coming out the bottom of the coach. Should I take this approach just to ensure the tank is full? (We did not see that on Sunday -- we just stopped when the CMP indicated full)

[David T. Richelderfer]

Our coach has two switches for operating the fill valve - one in the water bay as we would expect plus another one under the kitchen countertop accompanying a water pump on/off switch.  Interestingly, the fill valve switch under the kitchen countertop has been disconnected.  My guess is a prior owner of the coach had the same likely problem, that being opening the fill valve accidentally which causes the exact problem you describe - gurgling with a very small water stream at faucets.

Does the water pump run continuously even with all faucets off?  If our fill valve is on, then the water pump will run continuously... I assume pumping water in a circle from the fresh water tank to the coach plumbing system and back into the fresh water tank through the open fill valve.

[Joel Ashley]

On our coach we can see the tank where it's mounted in one bay next to the HydroHot.  Coaches are different between models, but I'd think somewhere you should be able to see it.  Our water tank is translucent so I can physically see how full it is, so you can verify things if you can hopefully find similar access, D.

If there's actually water in the tank, then it has to be a valve, or something floating in the tank that's blocked the intake, a highly unusual scenario.  Check the proper positioning of any in-line shut offs like our coach has around the pump, but if you replaced the pump you likely already did that.  The fact that the system was okay for awhile after filling is odd though, unless there's a blockage.  A slow leak would do it, but your monitor and physical viewing would reveal that.  A stuck open dump valve would be fairly obvious also;  been there, done that because you have to remember to hold the dump switch for a second or two or it doesn't fully turn off or on.

As others have noted and discussed in previous threads here, there have been issues with the fill valve not switching correctly.  If it didn't it would define your symptoms.

How about venting Guys?  How would D check for a plugged tank vent?  I know also it takes quite awhile at dewinterizing time to prime my pump to full flow, but given the entirety of his symptoms, priming is probably not the problem.

Joel

[Keith Moffett]

Wendal
We had a 98 Montecello.  The fill switch on our Marquis is electric instead of theknob inthe plumbing bay.  We had a similar problem on our 98. 
In the plumbing bay make sure all the area knobs point to 'on' and that the low point drain knobs are both in the 'off ' position. 
If the knob for filling the tank is off and you still have no water but the tank is not empty.  Check your connections at the new pump and make sure the direction of flow is right.  Pump output should be on the left I believe.
physicaly look at the tank in the bay with a flashlight to verify level.  If water is present then my guess is either the switch to fill the tank is bad or the new pump is loosing its prime.
Leave the pump running and cycle the fill knob on to off repeatedly.  Leave it in the on position for a minute or two.  Does this make a difference in the water flow or the sound of the pump?  Try it again in the off position.  Leave the pump running and the knob off for several minutes.  Does the sound from the pump change like it is trying to get a prime or bogging down?  If no then its probably a bad pump!

Hope this helps

[Joel Ashley]

I kinda doubt it's the pump, Keith, since the symptoms are the same as with the old one.  But you did hit on one thing I totally forgot... those pesky water manifold drain valves.  I've ran into priming problems before realizing one or more of the drain knobs were not fully closed on that manifold.  The pump spends its efforts forcing water down those instead of the faucets topside.

Still wouldn't explain his system being okay at the start unless it drained almost all of the tank eventually.  He really needs to get his eyes on the actual tank to verify its status.

Joel

[D. Wendal Attig]

Well guys thanks for all of your great input! As a result, here's what I did: I put the pressure regulator on the hose then connected it through the filter and into the city water inlet. I then opened the fill valve in the Water Bay and proceeded to service the tank until it overflowed- - which it did after about 45 minutes.

All faucet valves were left in the off position during the Servicing and during that time faucets were checked to ensure that the fill tank valve was functioning properly. I believe if the fill tank valve had not functioned properly the faucets would work as if they were receiving City water directly.

Once the tank was full, I shut off the fill tank valve and opened all of the service Point valves. Then systematically turned on the pump and purged the air. Both hot and cold running water are operational again at all service points!

Apparently the root cause of all of this was simply a lack of water in the tank.

Will follow up on this if another episode erupts. Thanks again as always for your help. It's great to have a a bunch of people like you who are willing to help a novice like me.

Yes, wife is happy again!

[Keith Moffett]

Sounds like the first filling created a siphon and all the waterjust went right out the tank over flow.  If it took 45 minutes to fill up you were empty.
You might have some improvement too by replaceing the city water inlet valve that the hose hooks to.  BCS offers a higher pressure one than original.  Better flow and shorter tank fill times.
 

[Joel Ashley]

Not sure I understand why your indication was still at over 60% when the pump sputtered though.  It may happen again if the culprit still lurks.  Did the sensor read 0 when it was actually empty?  Your Aladdin may need some attention if not.

Filling through filters can slow the process.

But glad the Missus is happy again ... for the time being.

Joel

[Robert Green]

Would anyone happen to know where the fill valve is located on a 2002 Beaver? 

No switch in the wet bay.
No switch located with the water pump switch in the kitchen.

Thank you for your assistance!

[Robert Green]

Forgot to mention. There is no valve in the carpeted box compartment that houses the low point drain and the water pump.  Thanks.

[David T. Richelderfer]

How do you fill your fresh water tank?  Just plug into it and turn on the faucet?  Does your water pump run all the time, even when no one has a faucet on?  If I leave the fill valve open after filling the fresh water tank, then the water pump will run endlessly, never shutting off, I assume pumping water in a circle through the fill valve and back into the water tank.

My fill valve is located right beside the water pump, and I have two fill valve switches - one that has been disconnected under the kitchen countertop and the other one in the water bay.