roof radius to sidewall sealing strip

[Jeremy Parrett]

My sidewall gutter has a rubber filet that is falling out.  I need to buy a replacment.  I may need to remove/replace the actual aluminum gutter and reseal it to the coach.
Does anyone know where I can get a replacement?
Is this gutter structural.....can it be removed altogether to give a smooth look to the coach??  

[Bill Sprague]

I took a tour through the parts room at Beaver Coach Sales and Service Center in Bend two weeks ago.  They had all kinds of stuff like that.

[Jeremy Parrett]

Thanks Bill, I will check with them Monday. Do you know if this gutter has any structural purpose?
 I think the Beaver would look a lot better without it.

[Bill Sprague]

........... Do you know if this gutter has any structural purpose?....

I do not.

[Gerald Farris]

Jeremy,
The gutter covers the splice line between the roof panel and the wall. If you remove the gutter, you will have to fiberglass the open seam that the gutter covers. A seam this long is very difficult to glass-in without it forming cracks as you drive, So even though the gutter is technically not structural, you do not want to remove it. The rubber filler strip is for appearance only, and serves no other purpose.

Gerald  

[Edward Buker]

Jeramy,

If you decide to rework this strip in any way be prepared to replace many of the screws used by the factory that have rusted. Some will break off and have to be redrilled in an adjacent spot. I found that white coated small hex head screws used for putting together exterior white aluminum structures were superior for this use. The head is small enough to fit below the rubber insert, they will not rust, and the back of the head is knurled to grip so they do not back out. There is aluminum structure behind this seam in the form of a box beam on my coach. I found that I needed a length that dead ended within the box beam. If I tried to go through both sides of the box beam the screws would sometime break off as thread cutting would be working to cut threads in the bottom hole while stripping threads in the top hole of the box beam. I do not remember the length off hand but you could take some measurements on a drill bit as you drill a hole. When you go through the first metal of the box beam the drill will then hit the second box beam wall. You want a screw that ends between those two dimensions. I drilled a larger hole until I hit the metal that would not have the treads catch and then an appropriate hole for the threads to grip in the metal so the structure could be pulled together. Finding a small head fastener that will fit below the rubber insert, strong enough so it will not shear (stainless did not work well for me), and will not rust leaves the options pretty thin here. If the present fasteners fail your roof to wall seam under this trim will begin to seperate and should be refastened. BCS should have the insert in rolls and perhaps Camping World might also.

Screw type link...http://www.allpointsscrew.com/catalog/Sheet%20Metal%20Screws.pdf  Order 10 by length you need in steel, zinc plated, and ceramic coated. I think mine were 1.5 inch but it has been awhile.....these are great small headed fasteners that will never rust.

Later Ed

[John Hennessey]

We had ours replaced at Bend.  They were unable to just replace a bent portion so they had to order as close a match as possible because the original style was no longer available. My husband took the plastic cover off and replaced the busted screws.  Then put silicone caulk and put the plastic cover back on.  That cured our leak.

[Jeremy Parrett]

Gerald,
 I wonder if the 20 foot X 8 inch slot the Girard awning sits in compromises this roof to sidewall seam.  
 There is very little distance between the top of the awning tray and the gutter.  
 I want to mount my awning the same way more recent coaches are done;without the recess cut out in the coach sidewall.   I am going to have the cut out glassed in. It is a source of continual leaks.  Maybe the people who build Prevost and others know how to seal this roof to sidewall seam with out resorting to renforcing it with a gutter?
Maybe the sidewalls are glassed to the frames??  

[Gerald Farris]

Jeremy,
No the roof to sidewall seam does not run through the the awning cutout. The seam is under the rain gutter. If you have the awning removed, you will have to reinforce or build-up the cutout back to the interior surface level of the fiberglass wall in order to remount the awning on the exterior wall.

It would be a lot cheaper to just have the awning resealed properly by someone who knows what they are doing like Beaver Coach Sales. There is no reason to go to the expense of removing the awning and fiber glassing in the opening to stop a leak.

As for your idea of having a Prevost shop remove your rain gutters. Prevost coaches are not fiberglass, and therefore equating their construction to the construction of your coach is like comparing apples and oranges.

Gerald  

[Edward Buker]

Jeramy,

I do not think the leaking that our coaches suffer from has much to do with the roof to sidewall seam. I believe the leaking is from water that gets into the poorly sealed recess box as Gerald points out in the decripion of the cure.

 My coach has not had leaking (that I know of) in this area but there is a rubber membrane that is bedded and then overlapped in a clear sealer (which I believe is the one that Gerald has mentioned for sealing around lights above the windshield) but the name escapes me. The membrane laps between the top of the awning and the coach sidewall below the trim strip.

Although this may not be as effective as sealing the box it seems to have worked well on this coach. I have been running the coach for 3 years and all I have done to this area is put Aerospace 303 protectant on the membrane several times a year. The end of the awning are also sealed with clear sealer to the coach. I do not know who did this job this way but it seems well done and reasonably effective if you are not going to pull the awning and have the box sealed which woud be optimum. I could also envision some material slipped under the roof to wall trim strip on the bottom side and clamped with the trim strip that is then sealed to the top of the awning...

Later Ed

[Jeremy Parrett]

Ed and Gerald,
Many thanks for your comments.  When the paint shop get to this, we will be better able to evaluate the situation and make changes as they see fit.
Do you have any idea how the sidewalls are attached to the frames??  

[Gerald Farris]

Jeremy,
The exterior walls are attached to the aluminum framing with a process that was called "VacuBonded" were the fiberglass wall is laminated (glued) to the framing with the use of a vacuum to compress the wall structure and remove any air pockets while the assembly cures.

Gerald

[Jeremy Parrett]

Gerald,
  that is good to know.  The same process is used building fibreglass hulls for sailboats and power boats.
There must be a fibrelass layer that runs over the inside of the frame and onto the sidewall .We call that bonding.Usually three or four layers of matt and cloth are used.  Then the whole section is wrapped in plastic and a vacuum drawn from inside the "bag" . This compresses the bonded area and extrudes air and excess resin making for a very strong bond. This process is known as "vacuum bagging" .
 This being the case it would be very easy to filet the seam between the top of the side wall and the roof radius to effect and very strong joint.
 My paint shop are going to see what can be done.  

[Edward Buker]

Jeramy,

That is a marine method that is stronger, but part of the purpose of embedding stringers or frame members in glass is to seal those structural members to keep bilge water and water in general out of those structural members for the life of the boat. RVs do not have that issue and I have not seen that method used in the RV industry.  My observation of vacuum bonding in the RV industry is used strictly for clamping the exterior sidewall on a flat table to a metal framework that has bonding adhesives on it. When cured the whole wall assembly is lifted into place. This process is not foolproof and the industry has had adhesion problems when the metal framework has not been prepped properly. If the trim strip is removed between the wall and the roof panel you will see that either one or both of the panels will moved and are mechanically clamped by the trim strip. I believe you need that strip for that purpose and would not want to fiberglass that seam. When I had some failed screws the trim strip refastening pulled the wall and roof panel back into place. RVs are not a perfect science and not as well constructed as a boat.

Later Ed

[Jeremy Parrett]

Hi ED,
  good information.  Now I understand the need for the gutter.  I wonder why Beaver didnt use glassfibre to bond the walls to the frame?
   Ah well.... we will go carefully.  Thanks .  Jeremy