No 120V AC following battery replacement

[Bill Johnson]

Today I swapped out the batteries in our 02 Patriot.  Following the replacement I have no 120v AC in the coach.  The 12V system is functioning "normally" but the Prosine says no AC in or out.  The SMC panel shows both AC legs have 124 volts.  I figure there is a master circuit breaker somewhere  but can't find it.  Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[Marty and Suzie Schenck]

Bill, On the Prosine unit itself, there is an off and on switch. Try turning it off and on at that switch. Every once in a while I will be working on something or turn the power off and then I have to reset that switch.
Marty

[Bill Johnson]

Thanks for the suggestion Marty.  I'll look at that in the morning.  If that switch acts as a breaker, that could be the source of the issue.  

[Edward Buker]

I suspect the transfer switch is not working at the moment and your generator side is connected but not generating. Try turning off all AC to the coach and then turn off all DC to the coach. Wait 15 seconds and turn on the DC first and then the AC shore power breaker at the box. See if that helps reset things.

Later Ed

[Bill Johnson]

Ed and Marty.  Here is the latest  The switch on the Prosine is on.  
I tried your suggestion Ed and now neither the AC nor DC will come on.  If I hold down the "Master Switch" by the entry door, I can get the lights (DC) to come on, but as soon as I release the switch, the DC is off again.  Any other suggestions?
Bill

[Edward Buker]

I think that Master Switch relay is supposed to be a latching type and it would seem that it is not latching. I belive it is located in the electrical bay below the driver seat but you may have to hunt elsewhere if it is not. Have someone repeatedly press that switch and listen for which relay the noise is coming from. Can also usually feel it if it is switching. Create a jumper wire of suitable gauge with lug connections and jumper the large terminals of the relay. That may restore the AC also if the transfer box circuit uses DC. You do not really need it anyway.

One more thing, if your battery voltage is down it may be that the relay does not have enough power to enable latching. Measure your battery voltage and if needed run an external charger to get the house and chassis batterie up to charge and then see if the relay will latch. You can bypass it if you like also as mentioned above.

Later Ed

[Bill Johnson]

Ed, Thanks for the suggestions.  I got the 12V system up and running again but still no AC registering in or out of the ProSine.  Battery voltage is still up around 12.5.  Can you tell me more about the transfer switch and where it could be located?  I checked the electrical bay and didn't see a schematic that shows the relay.

[Bill Johnson]

Got a status update for you.  I just tried getting power through the generator.  It fired up and provided power on one leg of my AC:  it gave AC power to the electrical heater on the Aqua hot but still no power on the second leg.  Nothing in the coach has AC, just power to one of the two legs.  When I turn off the generator and plug into external 50 Amp there is no power to either leg.  

[Edward Buker]

I assme that you have flipped your main AC breaker usually in the rear closet on and off to reset it. If bnot do that. The transfer relay box on my 2002 Marquis is on the ceiling of the storage bay in a grey box. If not there it is probably somewhere in the rear of the coach between the incoming power cord and the electrical panel.

later Ed

[Bill Johnson]

Ed. I did find the Transfer 50 (esco) box.  Actually there are two metal boxes, one labeled Power Transfer and the other the same size but no label, the wiring of the former passes through the latter.  Now the question is, what next?

[Dick Simonis]

I had a similar problem with the AC but due to a different problem.  I took a voltage spike that knocked out a lot of electrics and one item was the transfer switch.  It seems that the transfer switch defaults to the gen set and when shore power is applied, a voltage sensing circuit detects this power and actuates the switch into the shore power position.  In may case this voltage sensing circuit was killed by the spike so it wasn't actuating.  On the genset, I had only partial AC but later found that to be all the GFI's had tripped.

Different cause, but similar results.

[Edward Buker]

The Esco box is the one you want to open. You will find two large relays in there. They switch between the generator and the shorline power source for both the neutral and hot leads. Once you get the cover off measure between the shorline neutral and each hot lead to see if you have 120v on each leg. Then measure the output side and side between neutral and hot legs and see if the transfer is being made. If not this is the source of your problem. This is one version of an Esco 50 amp switch. The second box is a pass through box where sensing coils are used to pick up current flow and voltage measurement connections for the readout panel. That box should be fine.

http://www.escousa.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/LPT50BRD8x8x4TrblShootRepair020106.pdf

Later Ed

[Edward Buker]

If you find power coming into the relays and there is no way to get it working to send power out you could disconnect the shoreline 120V feeds and neutral that go to the relays and connect them to the ouput wires that go out to feed 120v to the coach. You could use some short lengths of similar gauge wire if there is not enough available along with the appropriate size wire nuts as a temporary repair. Leave the generator wires on the relays isolated from the coach and shoreline connections. Just be sure to get the connections of the neutral and hot sides wired correctly together. Usually they are color coded, red and black hot, white neutral, green ground. As always be sure the prosine is off, and coach unplugged from shoreline power when working on this once you have the original measurements done. This will allow shore power but no generator power to the coach until the transfer box is replaced.  Photo of my transfer switch relays. I am puzzled why this all happened with battery replacement, any ideas?

Later Ed

[Bill Johnson]

I want to give a status update (and finale) to the AC issue.  The solution to my problem was two-fold.  First, I did a thorough cleaning of the battery terminals (I should have done this initially, I know).  I then contacted ProSine and they gave me these instructions:  disconnect shore power and disconnect all battery power, also make sure the solar panel is not working (I covered it with a blanket).  Wait at least an hour (they said that in some cases it takes up to 6 hours) for the ProSine to de-energize at which time it does a "kind of re-set".  I waited one hour, re-connected all the power, uncovered the solar and everything is as should be.  So, all systems are go and nothing had to be replaced.  
Thanks for all the suggestions and I certainly would have gone the route suggested had the above-mentioned two steps not worked.

[Edward Buker]

Bill,

Glad you are back up and running. Sometimes these things can be mysteries in the making. I went in the direction of the transfer switch because you indicated that both legs of the AC from shore power were dead. The prosine is after the transfer switch on just one leg so some AC circuits should have been on. All that is important is that you are good to go again and thanks for letting us know. Hope the Gremlins stay far away...

Later Ed