No Turnsignals or Hazards

[Larry and Heidi Lee]

My turn signals and hazards are not working. The coach recently had an air line installed for my M&G braking system so it is possible the technician caused the problem. Before I crawl under the rig and look around I thought I would check in with you guys.

I do have functional running and brake lights. All other DC and AC is functional
No Power found at TB1-2 (LF Turn)
No Power found at TB1-3 (RT Turn)
12VDC at Breaker CB35
12VDC at breaker CB6
Does this rig have some sort of flasher system and if so, where is it located?

I am in a campground 300 miles from home and didn't bring my schematics. Any troubleshooting thoughts would be appreciated!

[LEAH DRAPER]

What about the fuses in the left front bay on drivers side.  I had brake lites fail and it had blown the fuse.

[Larry and Heidi Lee]

Does this coach have a fuse for the turn signals?  I have found a bank of breakers in the front left bay on drivers side, but no fuses. The breakers are closed.

I found a flasher switch inside the coach under the driver dash cover-no power coming to it...

I need an expert to tell me what TB1-2 and TB1-3 is for....

If anyone can scan this part of the circuit and email it to me I would greatly appreciate it.  llee@tigertechinc.com

[Joel Ashley]

I will try to send you what I have that may be useful, Larry.  I'll have to scan some of it that I don't already have in my computer.  Check your email.

TB means "Terminal Block".  TB1-2 stands for terminal #2 on Terminal Block 1.
TB1-3 stands for teminal #3 on Terminal Block 1.  I don't know off hand what components those terminals attach to though.
On the schematics I send you, the icon for a terminal looks like a bullseye.  

CB on the schematics means "Circuit Breaker", and the icon is a rectangle with two bullseye terminals in it.

K on the schematics means a relay, of which there are many in your electric bay.  I will email you a legend for the bay, but keep in mind it is for a 2006 coach, and is likely slightly different.  The schematics are labeled for a 2005, and Dennis Evans and I discovered at least one relay change;  he rewrote it for our 2006 coaches and I have that if you think you need it.  But theoretically your circuits should match the schematic, not the rewrite.

-Joel

[Larry and Heidi Lee]

Thanks Joel I received what you sent me but I need the entire circuit. As I recall the schematics I ordered from Beaver were very vague. I checked every circuit breaker in the front left driver bay and confirmed power at the breakers as well. I am at a loss and will see if Monaco has any insight tomorrow.

[Joel Ashley]

Good luck with Monaco.  See if Ames Jacoby there can give you any insight.

-Joel

[Larry and Heidi Lee]

I finally found the culprit! Intermittent connection betwen the electical compartment and the cab harness. I attached a picture of the corrosion found on the inside of the connector. I bypassed the connector completely and everything is now operational. Thanks to Joel for the schematic it was very helpful! Monaco was very helpful as well but they are only able to make suggestions based on a good circuit. Mine was degraded so the problem was not of the norm. I suggest everyone check the connectors in the electrical bay and keep them clean with contact cleaner.

[Joel Ashley]

If that connector had been sealed well, there shouldn't be that kind of corrosion.  I will certainly check all the connectors of that type in my bay, Larry.  Thanks for the report and heads up.  

With my electrical bay accumulating a half inch of water regularly while stored, I keep an eye on it in winter and spring when we get heavy precipitation.  Today I finally attempted as best I could to stifle the probable leak source, by applying Lexel to a bad spot in the windshield seal at the top.  For some time I've been keeping a dessicant unit (Dri-Z-Air) in the bay to draw any trapped moisture away from electric components, fittings, and the white backer board that started showing some very minor swelling and cracks, typical in high humidity.  

I thought I'd likely forgo that practice after I could get to Bend for a permanent windshield seal replacement, but perhaps we all would be well-served to keep a dessicant placement in our 12v. electric bays 24/7 at least during storage, and view it as part of necessary maintenance, like checking house battery fluid levels.  That bay is where nearly everything 12 volt comes together, and at least in many of our coaches has some vital system controllers in it, including Alladin, HWH air, and inverter/AGS, etc.  It's the last place you want moisture.

Thanks for adding fuel to my fire for that idea, Larry, and I'm glad you're road worthy again.

-Joel

[LEAH DRAPER]

Jøel

"perhaps we all would be well-served to keep a dessicant placement in our 12v. electric bays 24/7 at least during storage, and view it as part of necessary maintenance, like checking house battery fluid levels. "

EXCELLENT sugggestion, thanks for the idea!

Leah

[Joel Ashley]

I wonder, is any member aware of a dessicant product that uses a more enclosed unit than Dri-Z-Air's?  

That product's holder is open enough that accumulated liquid would be slopped out during travel, and therefore isn't practical for use while on the road.  It occurred to me that one could velcro down the pot so it wouldn't slide around in the compartment, but it would still slop fluid unless you remembered to check and empty it before each travel day.  To avoid that inconvenience, and likely oversight, I could fit the unit with a fitting and flexible tube that emptied through a hole in a bay floor corner, with a pinched-hose dirt-excluding drip fitting outside.  Then I just have to remember to refill with dessicant every so often.  But the accumulated fluid is likely not pure water, so it's possible chemical sediment, like calcium, would eventually plug up the pinch hose fitting.

Seems like a bit of "overkill", just to thwart my forgettfulness, so it would be cool if there was a different dissicant system out there that was more practical to my idea.  Does such an animal come to anyone's mind?  

Or should we just invent our own device and make the club rich selling it to others?  You know, the Bombastic Beaver Bay Bogginess Blocker.

-Joel

[Larry and Heidi Lee]

I also found that upon heavy continuous precipitation that water had found it's way into the electrical compartment. I was shocked to find the carpet lining was soaked. I was troubleshooting another electrical problem last year when I discovered the moisture AND the connectors being corroded. Although I cleaned the connectors apparently it still caused a problem here a year later. I suspect many of our coaches leak and unless you have a reason to open the electrical bay you would never know. I too have been re-sealing my windshield. I plan to eliminate those connectors completely somehow. I'm open to some ideas...
And the dessicant idea is brilliant Joel, I'll put that on the list!

[Edward Buker]

I'm not a big fan of dessicants here. That compartment is by no means air tight and there is a lot of humidity and condensation issues, perhaps even water leakage involved here which will very quickly deplete the absorbtion capability of any dessicant container. Dessicants work well in confined spaces that are well sealed so that they absorb available humidity that can then not be redily replenished.

I think a better strategy is to assure that the compartment is as well sealed as is practical and then spray the connectors, buss bars, spade lugs, and plug pins with Corrosion X. This product is a corrosion inhibitor and moisture displacer. It is the only product that has passsed the Navy's saltwater test requirements as a corrosion inhibitor and moisture displacer. Spray these areas once or twice a year and they will remain corrosion free.

 This strategy accepts that moisture will condense, or water may leak in but the coated metal is protected from forming corrosion by products. I have used this product liberally on a Honda Outboard Motor that is used in saltwater and it does what it claims to do. It is clear and coats surfaces but does not leave a mess. The Honda dealer where I live along the Gulf Coast removes all engine covers and totally coats the motors with each service....I picked this product and tip from him.

 http://www.corrosionx.com/corrosionx.html

If you currently have corrosion be sure and remove/clean the connections first and look for loose spade lugs or wire ends that need crimping. Hope this helps.

Later Ed

[Joel Ashley]

I think the Corrosion-X product sounds like it would stifle our corrosion issues, Ed, but I'd still include a desiccant as part of the plan.  The backer-board that all the relays, terminal blocks, breakers, and component controllers are mounted to is a wood-based product.  On my coach at least, it shows evidence of swelling and associated cracking around screws.  

[LEAH DRAPER]

I wonder, is any member aware of a dessicant product that uses a more enclosed unit than Dri-Z-Air's?  

That product's holder is open enough that accumulated liquid would be slopped out during travel, and therefore isn't practical for use while on the road.  

Joel,

Ever considered placing the device in a small dishpan so if it runs over there is some thing to catch it.?  Just a female response/idea.  Guess you could also velcro the dishpan down.

[Craig Rollins]

My realtor turned me on to  DampRid because we had a damp basement when we went to sell our house and they worked great. We also used the hanging style in our cargo trailer when we drove from MA to TX because my wife was concerned about mildew getting into our packed clothing in the more humid areas while we traveled. Again, they worked great.

http://www.damprid.com/product/hanging-moisture-absorber-14-oz-fg80-fresh-scent

It's available at the above link and also Home Depot and Lowe's.

Craig